Have boxers gotten better as time progressed?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Sugah Jay, Sep 19, 2014.


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  1. Gannicus

    Gannicus 2014 Poster of the Year Full Member

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    You're on my ignore list if you're just going to keep posting immature rubbish. You've been littering the General forum with this nonsense too. :patsch
     
    Gannicus, Sep 20, 2014
    Gannicus, Sep 20, 2014
    #31
  2. rossco666

    rossco666 Guest


    Boxers had more unique styles back in the old day's. They fought and sparred more so refined their skills to a much higher standard than today's fighters. There's a lot of lost art nowadays. for example parrying and inside offensive skills and inside defence is far lacking than what wee see in the old timers we have footage of. The ability to manipulate space inside is a lost art as well. Highly skilled offensive fighters have been replaced by face first brawlers like Rios. There hasn't been a truly great inside fighter since JCC IMO. People like to assume guys like Lamotta, Dempsey and Armstrong were unskilled fighters with no defence but in reality those guy's rolled and could ride punches like an art.

    Technically there have been some guy's far superior to some of the very old timers. The 80's and 90's produced some seriously gifted technicians like Tyson and Mcallum, those guy's were technically immense. Old timers like Joe Louis were not as technical as a Tyson or Mcallum but Louis had a style he truly mastered through constantly fighting and sparring. His accuracy and punch variety is unmatched and he's probably the best finisher in the history of boxing.
     
    rossco666, Sep 20, 2014
    rossco666, Sep 20, 2014
    #32
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  3. TheGOAT

    TheGOAT The Champ is Here ! banned

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    :lol::lol::patsch

    You don't understand. I'm calling out all ALT's, which you just so happen to be one. I know for a FACT that you are GGGisabum so deal with it.:thumbsup

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    TheGOAT, Sep 20, 2014
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  4. Gannicus

    Gannicus 2014 Poster of the Year Full Member

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    GGGisabum seems like Oneshot. Goodbye forever.
     
    Gannicus, Sep 20, 2014
    Gannicus, Sep 20, 2014
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  5. TheGOAT

    TheGOAT The Champ is Here ! banned

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    :rofl:roflWhatever you say Jacory.
     
    TheGOAT, Sep 20, 2014
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  6. TheGOAT

    TheGOAT The Champ is Here ! banned

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    You are uncany...called out , denying it, and still posting:lol:

    I think I like it...
     
    TheGOAT, Sep 20, 2014
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  7. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Higher fitness levels and the 12 round limit probably mean fighters move more, hence less infighting. But a lost art... nah. Castillo-Corrales is on terms with just about anything in terms of an inside war on high technical level. Floyd is very adept at the inside as well, but still has the legs to not have to stay there very often.

    Don't think parrying has been lost either. But when you have a good guard, there's just less need for it.

    Show me anything in black and white that shows off more skill than MAB-Marquez and Castillo-Corrales.

    EDIT: More unique styles? Maybe. But if anything this shows that fighters today are more properly schooled and text book. Would more Hameds in today's boxing instead of Rigos and Lomachenkos make it of a higher standard? Absolutely not.
     
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    #37
  8. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I can't see any major development in boxing skills over the last thirty or forty years. Conditioning seems to have improved as fighters seem to be maintaining peak form a lot longer. This explains fighters such as Mayweather and the Klitschkos still beating everyone at their advanced ages in recent times
     
    Stevie G, Sep 20, 2014
    Stevie G, Sep 20, 2014
    #38
  9. rossco666

    rossco666 Guest


    Higher fitness levels nowadays :nono Old timers had serious competition as gyms were much fuller in those days. plus more rounds, thinner gloves so the weak was separated from the chaff very early. The top fighters in those days had to have serious natural toughness and stamina and yes they also knew how to pace themselves as is obvious on film when watching fighters like Benton, this is not the case with fighters like Armstrong though. He was a freak.

    Yes Floyd is very good on the inside in terms of negating but as for offence he only really manipulates space to pot shoot, he does not have a great offence on the inside like a defensive master like Pea who could throw multiple combo's on the inside and still not get hit by return fire. Floyd is much more cautious.

    Skilled Parrying has been lost in this era for sure. You only really see it done masterfully by the old guy's like Floyd and Hopkins. When discussing lost art in boxing one of the first things that get brought up is parrying and fainting. It's still done but not masterfully. I was watching Benny Lynch the other day and clearly noticed how much he used his arms to manipulate the other fighters arms into positions he wanted to put them. High guard blocking has defo replaced the low arm parrying style of old, with the odd exception of course. Maybe there is less need for parrying nowadays. Old timers fought more and fought more rounds with thinner gloves and the parrying style was much more effective for not getting hurt.

    MAB-Marquez is a good shout but Castillo-Corrales is pretty lame. Great fight but hardly a brilliant showing of inside skill. I suppose Gatti-Ward would make your list of an inside brawl showcasing great inside skill. It doesnt, its just a great fight/fights/clash of styles.

    Armstrong vs Barney Ross was pretty darn good. A brutal showcasing of inside skills.
    Also, watch Joe Gans.
     
    rossco666, Sep 20, 2014
    rossco666, Sep 20, 2014
    #39
  10. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    You're seriously comparing Gatti-Ward to Castillo-Corrales in terms of skill level?

    Well, then you just plainly don't know what you're looking at, so we're not going to agree no matter how long we discuss.
     
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    #40
  11. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    I dont see any improvement in boxing over the last 30 years from technique, to fitness level, to durability, to anything. Watch an old Dumont clubfight from the 1950s and those clubfighters displayed a higher level of skill than the average contender today. Nevermind the fact that there was a lot less cherry picking in those days meaning fighters were well schooled to deal with a variety sizes, skills, boxers, punchers, leftys, rightys, etc. Nowadays fighters only choose to fight against a certain style or fighter they know they can beat. The shorter 12 rounds limit is tough for guys to finish today and thats with a lower activity rate. Money watered down and ruined the sport. Its why I bury my head in the sand watching the old timers and largely ignore the modern guys. Guys like Hopkins would have been good in any era but his breed is dying out.
     
    klompton2, Sep 20, 2014
    klompton2, Sep 20, 2014
    #41
  12. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Someone I noted is a skilled feinter is Maidana. There definitely is more to him than meets the eye at first glance.

    If we take the most skilled fighters of the last 10-15 years up to current time it would include : Toney, Hopkins, MAB, Mosley, Marquez, PBF, DLH, Ward, Rigo and Golovkin. Don't see where these guys fall very short in any category, really.
     
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    #42
  13. rossco666

    rossco666 Guest

    I never compared those fights. I assumed you would think Gatti-Ward showcased great inside skill because you seem to think Castillo-Corrales does which it probably does for the level of fighters competing. Hardly on the level of Armstrong-Ross. You did ask me to find better which I did X about 10 on that one.

    ''I dont know what I'm looking at''!?! :lol:
    Look, I'm no brilliant historian but trust me when It comes to boxing I know what I'm looking at. I watch fights every day and have learned a lot from some of the best posters on this site and others.
     
    rossco666, Sep 20, 2014
    rossco666, Sep 20, 2014
    #43
  14. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    This about "today's cherry picking" is really a croc of ****. No ****ing way that a champ could be such utter disgrace with his ducking today as for example Dempsey or Zale was. And no way a fighter like Robinson would have to wait as long for his shot today as he did in reality.

    And guys like Burley and Holman Williams don't have to labour their whole careers today without getting a chance at the big time.

    I actually think these rose tinted glasses are a bit sickening revisionist (even if things did get better from the 50's on).

    Sure, it's a shame that we never got to see the two outstanding HWs of their generation meet each other, but that was because they happened to be brothers. And Pac-Floyd should have happened years ago, but you can't really say these guys haven't made fights happen otherwise.

    The super six was a great thing, polished off with Ward then beating the then nr 1 LHW (an achievement many of course shat on after the fact).

    And Lomachenko debuting with a title challenge. Is that cherry picking?
     
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    #44
  15. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    If you can't see the skill of Castillo-Corrales you don't know what you're looking at. Period.
     
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    Bokaj, Sep 20, 2014
    #45
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