Al Haymon signs Chavez Jr.!!! Chavez vs Quillin next?

it is actually difficult. Without going into specifics, Arum has to prove that he gave chavez a reasonable offer.

With that gray area, this will arbritrate where top rank will get a percentage of chavez's next few fights.

 

Hmm, actually I would say killing Kovalev-Stevenson, Chavez-GGG, not letting Quillin take any real fights... and programming pretty much absolute garbage all year on SHO are reasons people are disliking Haymon.

The way everyone tries to rationalize everything around Manny/Arum or Floyd is why I hope they both get retired in spectacular fashion, the sooner the better.

There are other historical things some people take issue with regarding Haymon, just like some people never forgive/forget some of Bob's past issues.. but currently Floyd has little or nothing to do with the current round of distaste for Haymon.

As for signing people.... who knows. With the exception of Chavez, who was apparently promised a lot of money - much of his signees of late have been the Dawsons and Moras of the world.

 

Triple bum atsch

So tell us who out there at 160 beats Golovkin?

 

Didn't Top Rank have something to do with the non-occurrence of Golovkin-Chavez? Didn't HBO have something to do with Stevenson's defection to Showtime?

More to the point, quality of fights being made isn't particularly relevant to the issue of terrible precedents and the sacred Ali Act. Bashing farces like Garcia-Salka is perfectly fine from a fan's perspective, but it seems like self-righteous rubbish to frame such complaints as instead being about conflicts of interest. I'd further note that the networks airing mismatches and the actual promotional companies facilitating such events deserve the lion's share of scorn in such instances.

Finally, if the quality of fights alone is the chief criterion for judging boxing decision makers, as opposed to whether they treated their fighters fairly, we should all be longing for the return of Don King and lamenting anyone who ever bashed him for ripping off his guys.

 

The quality of fights, and Ali Act violations are not co-dependent arguments supporting each other, just different items in a list of issues.

Haymon's operation suffers from a number of separate concerns. The fight-making issues exist, the fight-scuttling issues exist, and the Ali Act issues exist. Whichever issue someone personally finds more or less important is largely irrelevant to the fact that all the issues do in fact exist.

The only people chiefly blaming TR or HBO for the issues listed are know long time Haymon apologists, or Arum haters. Like Arum or hate him, the JR/GGG fight was almost made and JR was offered very large sums of money relative to his recent viewership and ticket sales - got derailed when Haymon whispered in his ear with promises of big money if he declined the fight and left Arum.

HBO failed to nail down Stevenson-Kovalev bout in ironclad contract.. sure... but they had made clear that was the fight they really wanted, no surprises there - until Stevenson signed with Haymon. The fight was dead on the spot, though they tried to get HBO to pay big money for Fonfarra bout even though they would not commit to a Kovalev bout. Obviously HBO had no interest in overpaying for Fonfarra without Kovalev.

HBO's fault? For making Stevenson a star and investing in him with a verbal agreement to make a unification? Not sufficiently covering your arse in paperwork may have been a mistake but that hardly makes it their fault.

 

Haymons signing everybody but no ones signing Rigo atsch

 

No the Ali Act violations are largely a distraction designed to make legitimate complaints about bad fights instead become nobler concerns about the Good of Boxing. The only people making such complaints are of course other promoters (rather than boxers past or present the act is actually aimed at) and known haters of Haymon in the media. Fight-preventing is a likewise legitimate concern, though I'd note people didn't seem to have as much an issue with for instance a promotional company simply flat out stating they categorically won't do business with a particular manager, as has been Top Rank's philosophy towards Haymon since well before this year, the aftermath of their botched Pavlik-Williams negotiations to be precise.

I can just as easily say the Jr/GGG fight was almost made until Top Rank tried to forcibly include an extension Keane and Chavez had no interest in and then push Keane out altogether. Chavez had no interest in an extension all the way back in 2012 either, declaring he would not accept one as a condition of the Lee fight. Was Haymon already in his ear way back then?

This of course underlies the fact that the tampering you blame Haymon for is nothing more than alleged at best; a fighter wanting to test his value on the free market is not unreasonable. Just as Top Rank can do all their economic calculations to decide how much they'd have to cut his pay to let him go, Chavez is completely entitled to do his own calculations to decide if such a paycut is worth accepting for a fight.

We've been through this before, but the best way of really wanting a fight is to be willing to pay for it. According to Michel, HBO didn't want the fight enough to put up any more for it than they did for Ward's tune-up last year.

Why is Haymon alone responsible for a fight being dead on the spot? It would seem to me a network prohibiting a particular manager from its airwaves would have the potential to prevent or scuttle fights from being made, even those the network in question may "really want."

Stevenson may have had a thing or two to do with his star power, and not covering your arse contractually is a big enough mistake that not getting what you wanted can only be your fault.

 

no they are not dumbass its now al gaymon controlling their careers its the same ****.most fighters aren't big enough to promote themselves they don't have enough leverage.they have to give up some control to somebody.

 

fuk you al gaymon is acting like a promoter and a manager which is of course illegal get the fuk out of here.hbo doesn't want to work with gaymon because they are tired of the shitty showcase fights.

 

You could say the JR/TR issue was TR's fault - but despite JR/Keene pitching it as a "contract extension" when trying to explain to the fans/media why they bottled up, the fact is he was offered a minimum of 12 million for two fights. Which they were perfectly OK with until Haymon popped in. Haymon apparently entered via Keene, who stopped negotiating with TR at Haymons request. Reportedly many of TR's offers did not even make it to JR. Keene is now fired, even though JR is still leaving TR.

I dont buy your Stevenson line at all, thats just not how honest people do business. You are trying to make an argument that a victim is the criminal and not the criminal, for not sufficiently protecting themselves. The victim may have made a mistake, but they still are not the criminal. (just making an analogy btw, not accusing Haymon of criminal behavior)

The Ali Act violations are what they are. You cannot deny they are real. Whether you feel they are important is your own opinion.

Also, while HBO will not deal with Haymon directly - they will allow his fighters on the network in certain instances. Basically if they do not have to deal with him. Ward/E-Rod aside they greenlight a GGG/Quillin fight and TeamGGG sent an actual offer. HBO would have allowed Stevenson to fight Kovalev. They just wont deal with Haymon directly. If its via an intermediary, and its a fight they want they will allow it.

 

Evidence for any of this other than media figures sympathetic to TR? Especially the part about Keane and being "perfectly okay" with the contract extension? You also failed to address the point that Chavez was already resistant to any kind of contract extension as far back as 2012.

HBO is not a victim though of anything except their own stupidity. HBO has constantly placed business above the good of boxing; it's not an outrage when boxers themselves do so, and appeals to the network "making" Stevenson or being owed a fight are nothing more than self-righteous pap.

I can to the extent that they haven't been demonstrated. And I can dismiss those wanting to talk about them in the context of Haymon, as opposed to say, Arum, as disingenuous at best. And as I said in one of my first posts in this thread, even if they are real, they're not a particular concern to me relative to other Ali Act violations due to the satisfaction of the boxers the law is actually designed to protect, as opposed to sour grapes promoters or media members.

So they'll allow Haymon fighters on, as long as the fighters in question don't receive his representation? Boy that sure sounds a lot better for the interests of boxers than that swindlin fight-scuttlin no-good Al Haymon!

 

Id!otic thread. Jr can barely make 169 let alone 160. Buy a clue before you post.