Is Sugar Ray Leonard the best fighter ever?

Indeed, though I think it would've set Ray back a little after the defeat.:good

 

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Agreed. It could have been anybody's fight. And I've never bought this logic that a younger Marvin should be automatically favored, as if people are forgetting Ray was better in 1982 than he was n 1987.

 

The fight would've definitely moved faster, but Leonard would be facing a closer-to-prime Hagler, and despite his skills, he would've been out of his depth facing this version of Marvin.He loses a decison, possibly close, though I doubt it.

 

Have to agree, hagler wasn't nearly the same monster by the time leonard got to him.
Whilst leonard had aged too he was still only 30 and had been lying on sun loungers on the beach while hagler was in gruelling heavy punching wars of attrition with mugabi, hearns and Roldan, not to mention all the hard sparring and gym sessions over those years. and he'd really looked old against mugabi. Many report that it was watching hagler against mugabi which prompted leonard to finally return to the ring to make the fight.
Hagler had lost more going in than leonard who was much fresher on the night despite not boxing for 3 years.
Plus Leonards insistence on a 24ft ring, 12oz gloves and shaving three rounds off the correct championship distance skews the merit of the win a bit.
That said I still thought hagler won, though he left it too close to argue too much.
I personally feel that a fresh, prime hagler would be too much for leonard who would be lucky to see the true championship rounds.

 

Why was there never a rematch?

 

Right from the horses mouth... Goody told me that Marvin and Petronelli`s pushed hard for a rematch,but SRL did not want it. Hagler grew frustrated with not being able to get SRL back into the ring.
So Marvin came in had a sitdown with Goody and said the only fight he wanted was Leonard. So he walked away for good when he couldn`t get the rematch...

 

why not, becuz Ray got hisself knocked out?

again, give me a good reason why not

Hector was only five years Ray's jr but was much more worn out due to the flogging he took from Chavez and the fact that he lost to Hauger, a fighter he once wouldve hadnled without losing a round

that was 7 years earlier and so Hector has every right to be considered as worn out as Leoanrd, and even MORE so

Now let's talk about the REAL differences - height and reach, 7 inches reach to be exact

not to mention Hector was actually a blown up featherweight so it more than evens out

Nobody but NOBODY said before hand this was an unfair fight so you really have no case!

when did you ever hear Saraceno or O'Grady or anyone for that matter say "Leonard's gonna get hurt in THIS ONE!"

like Leonard, everyone thought they were going to see a meek passive no-heart Camacho and instead, out pops a fighting mad bull who had leonard in panic mode, and made him collapse in a paroxysm of fear

as for prime Hagler vs prime Leonard, there's a good reason why Leonard didnt want this match; becuz he wouldve gotten hisself stopped in ridiculously easy - Nunn - Kalambay style. The man had no chin. We all saw it in the Geraldo fight and people here are talking that Ray is going the distance? HELL ****IN NO WAY!!

or as Debbie Gisbon would say about SRL fans "it was only in my dreams"

 

I see you're still talking about Camacho.


I suppose it's better than repeatedly talking about Norris though.


Floyd isn't better than Ray.

Longevity is only one factor when looking at a resume.


As if Floyd would have fought the guys that Ray did?

If he'd have been the same size, in the same era, he'd have taken more vacations than Clark Griswald.

Fighting Maidana twice was great wasn't it?

 

why not? they both laced him pretty good so one is just as good as the other and there's not really much you can do about it

you really have no ammunition at all

Terry and Hector both conquered Ray in dominant fashion

and Floyd has never lost whereas rey lost several years earlier in his career

that means Floyd triumphed whereas Ray fell apart completely years earlier

Floyd rocks!

but the way you tell it, it's as if you're in a position to tell it as it is even though you know I've seen Ray fall to both Hector & Terry in an absurdly sort career you seem to be impressed with

He's inferior to Floyd both in record and career length, even tho you try to dictate the terms with your favorite mantra of "Floyd never fought the guys Ray did, nyah nyah!"

that's all you have to go on - hypotheticals and hypotheticals can never be proven!

Ray hasnt faced Floyd's opposition either so there!

all you talk about is the lightweight who jumped two divisions to kick his ass, the shot middleweight he couldnt find the nerve to fight in prime time, and the three years from his prime Hitman?

you're deluded. Floyd rules. now go fly a kite

 

I don't care if Ray lost to Camacho and Norris, and Floyd is unbeaten.

It happens.

Floyd could carry on fighting way past his best and lose.

He had a close call with Maidana.

How can Ray have an inferior record to Floyd?

Ray didn't face Floyd's comp?

Ray fought peak versions of Benitez and Hearns. He fought a near peak version of Duran, and he fought Hagler after a three year lay off.

Floyd has never beaten an ATG while they were prime.

Their resumes aren't even close.

Floyd rules?

Go and educate yourself.

 

yeah, he also got schooled by Norris

and those Hagler & lalonde fights were a joke

no fighter in history has gone unbeaten as long as Floyd. but you want to serve me up a pile of manure with an explanation of "it happens"

i'm sorry to tell you this, but it DOESNT happen unless you are a once in a century talent which, Floyd is

and you're right; their resumes arent close.

Floyd is 47-0 at the ripe age of 38. that means Leonard can never catch Floyd

becuz his record is an average 36-3-1

read 'em and weep! :yep

Floyd has so many distinctions and awards, it makes my head spin!

there hast been a fighter this good since Terry and Roy ruled the 154 160 pound divisions in the 90s when they terrorized their respective divisions with their speed

and here you still are in complete denial, behind the times, still talking about Leonard-Duran, & Leonard-Hearns

With Floyd, many have tried but many have died trying to better him

Leonard just didnt have that same aura of invincibility. You always had that sense of him losing whereas with Floyd, you dont

 

Don't you ever get tired of trotting out Terry ****ing Norris? Jesusatsch

 

alot of people here like to put him down. to these people, nothing he does counts yet he has achieved more than anyone at his weight. I'm just giving him his just due

Mike was good too

 

Everyone's circumstances are different.

Floyd's unbeaten.

But would he have been if he'd have fought guys in their prime, or some of Ray's opponents?

Joe Calzaghe and Rocky Marciano retired undefeated.

So what?

You're such an idiot!

Despite the losses, Floyd's resume is nowhere near Ray's resume.

If Ray had retired at 4-0 after wins over Benitez, Hearns, Duran and Hagler, it would eclipse Floyd's resume.

Don't bother replying to me, because we're done here.

It would be pointless to carry on.