Jeffries got what he deserved ...

Absolutely not. I'm just saying somehow JJ managed to be more resented than a alcoholic convicted murderer.

 

If this is the case than we've been fighting over nothing really.

None but there's been a great deal of justification. Johnson had a part in all the mess. There's a limit to what you can pin to his life experience.

 

Books are full of those relative few positive comments because it makes a better story to discuss how persecuted he was than to pile on him. Go back and read the black press, the American white press, the british press, the french press, and cuban press, the mexican press, the canadian press? No? I didnt think so. To date not a single person arguing on this thread trying to justify Johnson's behavior, and yes, go back and read, at the very least Kurupt has, has addressed that simple fact that it wasnt just a black/white issue with virulent racists in the USA going after Johnson but people from all walks of life found him a detestable human being. Thats not an opinion and that is something I can prove. Do you want to go through and post a laundry list of quotes from various domestic and international papers that will far outstrip the odd "nice" comment that guys like Geof Ward can squeeze out? That would be FAR easier than the laundry list of black instigated violence in the wake of Johnson-Jeffries I posted.

Finally, you are absolutely wrong that they didnt let Jack Blackburn speak for Joe Louis. I have several interviews with Blackburn on film and from the radio where he was interviewed on Louis' behalf in the locker room, at training camps, at weigh ins, press conferences, and contract signings. To me thats neither here nor there and has no real bearing on my argument but its a fact that needs addressing none the less.

 

atsch Than yes.

 

Then you have not read everything. Johnson old manager called him a bad guy.

 

Got that McVey? The guy was a jerk, a cheat, a wife beater, a liar, a law breaker, a pimp, and an @ss. He just happened to also be a top fighter of the times.

 

Actually that wasn't solely at what I was talking about, that was just one example. Which by the way, has proven adequate in some cases. However, I was referring to events early on in life that can have negative effects one's behavior later in life. Whether that be something as simple as watching your dad smoke... and thus becoming a smoker. To a woman being ****d and causing her to turn to drugs and other vices to coup. These things couldn't be anymore well documented and proven via case studies by people more educated on the subject than you or I. This is what I'm referring to. This notion that you can have a huge segment of the population against you.. hate you.. spit at you... tell you who you're allowed to date wouldn't have consequences is unreal. We doctors talking about how bullying can be very detrimental to ones mental stability and confidence. Yet, when a great number of people make you feel subhuman and less than them.. that wouldn't have any negative effects? Get real. This is what I'm talking about and what has been proven over and over. It will have negative consequences and have an impact on your behavior and actions. There is simply no way around that.

 

***

 

So we don't find newspapers from the time period in question using vile and derogatory words towards black people? We certainly do. We don't find newspapers sugar coating things towards whites but painting a much difference picture when discussing blacks? We certainly do. Yet, you think you can post excerpts from newspapers saying it was the blacks that started incidents and you'll believe that will total certainty? Sorry I can't do the same. I'm sure some of the incidents were caused and started by blacks. I can assure you of something else.. Some of those articles were painting a different picture than what actually occurred. Most of the violent crimes and deaths were attributed to black on white crimes but white on black crimes.

 

You keep focusing on his white women and trying to redirect the conversation there. Im not biting. The criticism of Johnson wasnt nearly "99.9%" focused on that. Not even close. Good try but that dog dont hunt. The criticism was overwhelmingly about his behavior. The guy made enemies wherever he went. He certainly wasnt the only black man much less black fighter who fooled around with white women. Furthermore, that wasnt nearly as much of an issue on continental Europe as it was here and he still managed to get kicked out of several countries and make more enemies than friends. Like I said, once again, nobody wants to address that issue. All of you Johnson apologists want to focus solely on his "treatment" here in the United States but want to totally ignore the inconvenient fact that he was hated pretty much everywhere and the most common theme in his criticism wasnt women it was his behavior. His behavior toward others, his wanton refusal to adhere to the letter of the law, and his belief that he was above everyone else. That is a common theme seen everywhere you read about Johnson. Not just in conservative american white newspapers. Its in EVERY press from every country. You can pretend it wasnt but it was and thats a fact thats easily discernible without having been there. Your best proof is an article written by his "last wife"??? I wonder what his first two wives would add to that?

 

Come on HE, I know your better that this. You know Johnson had all sorts of trouble with lots of people and the law. In the ring, he was also disrespectful and sometimes a little dirty.

Being the 1st black heavyweight champion ( *Peter Jackson won the British Empire Title which was also huge * ) Johnson often gets propped up as a civil right trail blazer. But in reality it was Johnson who violated other people’s rights.

Boxing has had its share of scum bags, McCoy, LaMotta, Liston, Tyson etc...

Yet Johnson's name is never in the conversation even though he beat his wife within an inch of her life. A bit interesting as to why. I think some circles give him as pass just because he was the first black champion. If he was a 4th, things would be very different.