Larry Holmes: Klitschko has no jab, no heart and would be beaten by Wilder or Stivern

Actually, Spinks was a bit of a cherry pick gone wrong to get Larry a sellable name for 49-0 and add a new angle- the potential for an active LHW champ to win the heavyweight title, which had never been done.

His last fight at light heavy was only 3 months before he beat Holmes and King had to pay him a fortune relative to what Spinks had been making to move up in weight. Mike was a 6-1 underdog in that fight even after he came in heavier than expected. The media was generally about as dismissive as this article here, which also mentions the odds.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...FwxAAAAIBAJ&sjid=xW4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=2882,5957397

 

BTW i have a question, who was the last HW, who was ranked number 2 for P2P ?

 

Spinks (alongside 90% of the bums Holmes fought) wouldn't be a top 5 HW today. He wouldn't even campaign at HW. He'd cook down to CW, maybe even LHW where he belongs because he couldn't earn a paycheck in today's HW landscape.

 

Because he wasn't liked for beating on Ali.

Why is Holmes vs Norton ranked as the 10th greatest HW fight of all time.

Why has Ring ranked the final round of that fight 7th most exciting in boxing history.

When Holmes came around , the division wasn't at an all time low like it is now.
He had massive shoes to fill , but has stood the test of time.

 

And who exactly say the division is all time low ? Only idiots, who dont wanna admit how good Klitschko is, so they are finding all type of excuses, like you.
And its fun how i prove you wrong and wrong, times after times, and you cant even answer, cause you cant say anything.
I like you that way, STFED and KTFED !!!

 

Spinks would embarrass Pulev who was the #1 contender in this era.

 

Frazier was liked for beating Ali, but Holmes wasn't? :rofl:rofl:rofl

Holmes was boring, uncharismatic, dominated one of the worst eras of HW boxing and then - after his prime - was destroyed by Mike Tyson. That's why historians now look back at Holmes and don't think too highly of him.

Holmes now talking shiet about Mayweather and Wlad makes him look like a complete idiot.

 

Ali gave the humble Frazier a terrible time and Ali was past it when he was battered by Holmes.

Everything you just said 100% incorrect.

Holmes is regarded as a top 5 ATG HW by everybody right across the board.

 

Well who's Wlad beaten who's great?

He was beaten three times in his 20's, by non great opposition.

Since then, he's gone ten years undefeated, which deserves a lot of respect.

But could he have gone ten years undefeated, in earlier eras? Not in my opinion.


Look, I don't mind if you think that Wlad would have beaten Larry. I can respect that. But I don't like the way that you've dismissed Larry's chances, on the grounds that he lost to Spinks and Tyson. I could say to you, that Wlad lost to Sanders and Brewster, and seeing as though Holmes was better, then he'd have beaten Wlad easily. That's basically what you've done.

In a fantasy match up, you have to take many things into consideration, and examine each guys strengths and weaknesses, while backing up your points with logical opinions.

If both Wlad and Larry fought each other on their best night, I think it would have been a very close, competitive fight. I don't see any evidence where Wlad would have beaten him with ease.


Now have a look at today's top 20 guys. Yes, most of them are bigger. But are they any more skilled? Are they better fighters? I think the top 20 fighters of Larry's era, were better than today's guys. Far too much emphasis is put on size.


So what if Mike Tyson would today be giving up an awful lot in size and weight? He had many great attributes that compensated for his lack of size and weight. Take Mike at his best, fighting to his full capabilities, and put him against today's top 20 guys. Who do you honestly think would have beaten him?


Michael Spinks would also cause the HW's of today problems. You can't look at him merely as a LHW.


I agree with you that if a fighter fights past his best, that it's their responsibility. But the only reason why I've mentioned Holmes was past his best against Tyson, is because it's true, and because you've used that as evidence of why you think that Larry couldn't have beaten Wlad.

 

He fought and beat Spinks in the rematch.

 

You're quite right.

I've gotten mixed up.

Of course the Holmes fight was Spink's first fight at the weight. He wasn't an established HW at the time.

Thanks for kicking my a$$ and correcting me. :good


But the point I was making, was that Spinks, even as a HW, was a very good fighter, and the Holmes fights were close.

It appears that lordlosh is laughing at the idea that Larry would have beaten Wlad, on the basis of he lost to a LHW.

But that criteria isn't objective in any way.

 

So Holmes was beaten 6 times, and some of this loses are from totally nobody.
Klitschko loses are atleast against a guys with High KO ratio. And 2 of them was do the stamina, which he improve a lot since then.
And in boxing everyone can beat everyone. The main thing is we can only debate and think what can happen. This fight cant be done, so we can only argue about that.
I say it why i think Klitschko will beat Holmes. My opinion is his is faster, stronger, more powerfull, have both reach and height advantage, he is smarter, as well better in technical and tactical aspect, better defence and control the distance like no one else.

And today guys are not only bigger, they are stronger, more powerful, still they are fast, a lot of them are technical better(there is always exceptions), with better defence and very imporant, they are better prepared in training, sparr and tactical as well. They examine the opponents very, very thoroughly.
For example Foreman was like stup*** wild ****** against Ali, with no tactic, no defence and half guard, and he lose by superb id*** way. What was his id*** tactic? Did he even know how Ali fight ? Did he even watch Ali fight? Did he even examine him ?
Even Tyson say it, athlete get better with time, its a whole different game. = https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BF-sxSipAMs

And i dont need Tyson to say it, some people just dont wanna believe it, but in reality that is the truth in most of the sport.
The knowledge from the past is not lost, its improve, so athlete cant get worst, in the physics department, athlete get better. Tho of course they are exception, also there is mental part, and the talent.
You train by one way 10 years ago, but as times goes on, you will understand and see, what is better and will improve your training and so on.
You get my point?
Im talking for the most, not everyone. There is always exception and phenomenons, that cant be seen for decades.
And for Spinks i dont see him in today HW and i think he will lost to a lot of todays guys.
The truth is 10 or 20 kg on their level is very, very big difference. And when we are talking about pure muscle, even 3-5kg. can make the difference.

 

What specific skills?

Skills - Wlad is an Olympic Gold Medalist. Larry is not. The Olympics is the ultimate show of talent. Edge Wlad.

Chin - Possibly. I'll give this to you. Wlad has been knocked down more times. Edge Larry.

Heart - How? Wlad has been knocked down and has got up and beat his opponent (4x at least). Wlad also got knocked down 3x in one fight and won. Holmes did it 3x I believe. Edge Wlad.

Stamina - I'll give this to you considering Wlad had problems with stamina in the past. He's 6'7 245 pounds for Christ sake. Edge Larry.

Work Rate - Wlad has thrown the most jabs in a HW championship fight. Edge Wlad.

Punch Variety - Wlad throws almost everything, but he doesn't go to the body since he is 6'7 and that would give his opponent the advantage. He doesn't throw the uppercut much. Larry doesn't hook off the jab as well as Wlad. Even.

Jab - Wlad's is stronger, as fast, uses it for a much larger variety of ways. Edge Wlad.

Movement - They both move quickly and are usually in good spots when they decide to go on the offensive. Different types of movements. Even.

Opposition - Wlad has beaten a wider selection of styles. Taller, stronger, better Olympic background. Unified champions. Edge Wlad.

Entertainment Value - Wlad knocks guys out. Larry put on a show a little more. Larry wasn't hugely popular. Even.

Wlad
5

Larry
2

Even
3

 

I didn't know this. Good points (if they are correct).

 

Speed goes clearly to Larry man.