Explain the Ducking History of Great Fighters Part I: Roy Jones

KillSomething,

Did Roy have psychic powers and know how things were going to work out?

He moved up when he couldn't unify.

So Liles was out of the equation.

So who was left?

Collins.


Yes, DM was at LHW, along with Hill and Griffin etc.

You've just admitted that you'd have trashed him had he stayed at SMW and fought poor opposition.

So look who was at SMW in late 96, and take Benn and Liles out of the equation. Let's say he'd have fought Collins. WHO could he have fought afterwards? Tell me.

Who??

You've trashed him for going up, and you'd have trashed him for staying.


But the hilarious thing is, YOU DIDN'T EVEN KNOW WHO HE WAS BACK THEN!

He contemplated going to HW, before he beat Griffin.

He then couldn't agree terms to fight Nunn, because he wanted more than what was on offer.

Do you understand?

Read slowly, and carefully.

Now go and take a few mins, and let it sink in.

After he couldn't agree terms with Nunn, he went to Atlanta to meet with Evander and Thomas.

They weren't interested, because Evander thought that he was in a no win situation at the time.

Do you understand?

He then lined up Douglas, for more than THREE times the amount of what Nunn would have brought.

But at the last moment, his father intervened. Roy was under a lot of pressure from the rest of his family to let his father back into his life. Because they hadn't spoke properly since their split in 1992. That was 6 years of not talking to each other, after spending literally everyday together for 23 years. So Roy backed down.

Do you understand?

Roy then ended up fighting Hill for $3m.

He made $3m instead of $1.8m, and he was given a Rolls Royce Corniche as a gift.

Nunn then went on to lose to Roch, who you've painted as this mythical beast, despite the fact that he lost to Eubank, DM, Maske, and drew with Seillier.

So Ruiz was meaningless, but a win against a limited Collins, would have been UNBELIEVABLE?

Ruiz was meaningless, and if only Roy had dared to have stepped through the ropes against the guy who lost to Eubank and drew with Seillier, that too could have been an UNBELIEVABLE win!

Right?

You're an embarrassment.

You've been shown proof that he tried to fight for the MAIN titles at SMW, so who cares about Collins?

You don't rate the Ruiz win, yet you rate Collin's wins over a shot Benn?

Oh it was oh so simple wasn't it?

Did you enjoy the fight between Frankie Liles and Steve Collins?

How about the great fight between Joe Calzaghe and Sven Ottke?

They were great weren't they?

Everybody knows that all the champs fight each other, without any issues.

atsch

You mean APART from the time that he tried to fight Benn and Liles for the WBA and WBC belts at SMW?

Again, you're an embarrassment.

All the trinkets don't mean anything?

You: Why didn't he fight Collins?

Joe had the lineal title?

Whoopee f*cking doo!

He beat a faded Eubank for the WBO, and ten years later he beat Kessler, who had one of Ottke's old belts. Wow!

You'd have trashed Roy for staying at SMW when he couldn't unify, yet you'll praise Joe for doing just that!

Joe edges him?

Joe never ducked anyone?

:rofl

Seriously, you haven't gotten your 25m swimming badge, and now you're stuck right in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.

You are completely out of your depth!

Trying to argue about subjects that you know nothing about.

Stop. You have no knowledge about the weight loss, which is evident on your other thread.

Clueless!

 

KillSomething,

What exactly did you want Roy to do? Did you want him to say "I don't agree with how Dariusz was stripped, so I'm afraid I'm going to have to decline your offer of a title fight." ?

We have proof that he couldn't unify at SMW.

Roy wasn't prime either, and he'd fractured his hand. Bernard didn't lose another fight until 12 years later.

How could Ruiz not have been a champion?

If Ruiz wasn't a champion, then neither was Wlad, Sanders and Byrd.

How was he a useless HW, when he'd beaten Holyfield, Johnson, Rahman and Golota?

Just how dense are you?

Roy hardly did anything at MW. Because his career only started to move, after he'd split with his father in 92. He beat Hopkins in 93, made one defence of the title against Tate, and then challenged one of the best fighters in the world in Toney. There was only a small window of opportunity to fight Gerald. It would have made more sense at SMW, if not for the tragedy against Benn.

Correct. But everyone knows it wasn't possible. Roy couldn't get those fights, just like how Joe Calzaghe couldn't get the Ottke fight.

Again, you can't hold Roy responsible for what had happened with the stripping of Dariusz. Neither fighter would travel to fight each other, but efforts were made by HBO, after Dariusz said he had no issue with going to the U.S.

Go and look who Dariusz fought. Roy's LHW resume is superior.

He only had the WBC belt at that time, and he gave up the opportunity to fight Nunn, for a big money fight at HW. He dropped the belt, and then pursued a fight with Evander.

F*ck fighting a southpaw who was good? Yeah, I mean it's not like Roy went on to fight Reggie, Hall, Tarver x 3, and Calzaghe, right?

Who cares that he didn't fight Roch? He wasn't a great fighter, and I've read links where HBO weren't particularly bothered about it.

You'll just enhance any guy who Roy didn't fight.

Hold on.

The WBA belt meant nothing.

Yet you wanted him to fight Byrd and Wlad?

Right.


Ruiz's belt was devoid of ANY significance?

Lewis beat Evander in a close fight in their rematch.

Ruiz then beat Evander for the vacant belt.

They had three close fights, and Evander proved throughout that period that he'd still got some gas left in the tank. Lewis went on to lose to Hasim Rahman who Ruiz beat, so it's clear that Ruiz wasn't the worthless bum that you make him out to be.


This is how dense you are:

Ruiz had wins over Evander, Johnson, Golota, and Rahman.


You think that Roy's win over him was worthless.


Yet Collins's best wins were against a past his best Eubank, and a shot Benn.


Roch's best wins were against Scully and a faded Nunn.





Like I say, you're CLUELESS!

And?

He's still one of the best fighters of all time, who accomplished a hell of a lot in his career.


:hi:

 

I don't think he wanted anything to do with Parks in '93-'94, Eubank in '96-'97, or Nunn in '98.

 

We know he didn't want Nunn in 97.

Parks retired in 94, and why would Roy have pursued him?

Why would he have wanted to fight Eubank at LHW? Roy fought Griffin, and had his sights set on Virgil Hill. Eubank had recently lost twice to Collins.

 

Killsomething is looking at Roy's career in hindsight...

He wasn't watching him back then, doesn't know how big of a risk it was thought of at the time to move up and fight Toney... Or even Ruiz...

He must have a lot of time on his hands, to know this much about boxing to not have followed boxing when Roy was prime.

Probably a basement dweller.

 

:good


It's just hilarious how he says that the Ruiz win was meaningless, yet whines that Roy didn't fight Collins and Roch.

Collins's best wins were against Eubank (who was lucky not to have had three defeats on his resume at that point) and Benn, who was shot, and who had to bet money on himself in order to give himself a lift.

Roch's best wins were against Scully and a faded Nunn.


The guy's a boxrec joker!

 

Parks really

Oh brotha atsch

 

Just seen a post on FB of the Griffen 1st round KO Jones never even used his jab just threw power shots. To many people on here forget how good he was.

 

Collins was a much more accomplished fighter than Ruiz. It isn't even close. Ruiz was a laughingstock. He literally 'won' fights by clinching 300 times a fight. He had no skills other than the clinch. He couldn't KO anyone couldn't out skill anyone. He never won a decisive decision go look at his fights they were all close controversial decisions. Every single one. He was a cancer on the Heavyweight division.

 

Yeah!

He was pi$$ed that night, in seek and destroy mode.

That lead uppercut was a thing of beauty.

:good

 

Ruiz was awful to watch.

But you can't change the facts.

He was decent, and he had decent wins.

Wins over Evander, Johnson, Rahman, and Golota were decent.


Now strip Collin's career down.

He was tough, with an iron will. But he was limited. His claim to fame was beating Eubank and a shot Benn. Some people think those wins were great, because those two fighters were very good-great in their prime, and he beat them both twice.

Now if he'd have comprehensively beaten Eubank in their first fight, a rematch would never have been necessary. Benn should never have come out of retirement. The only reason he fought Benn for the second time, was because Benn had injured his ankle in the first fight.

So it may look great him having Eubank x 2, and Benn x 2 on his resume, but in reality, they were nothing super special.


It's completely ridiculous to dismiss Roy's win over Ruiz, while questioning why he didn't fight a WBO belt holder, who although was skilful and tough, was nothing special.


The same applies to Roch. KS getting all upset because Roy didn't fight Roch, who was a good fighter, but who's best wins were against a faded Nunn, and Scully.


It's madness.

 

I agree Roy is a great fighter, but it does seem he ducked several ppl. Probably worse than Floyd.

You don't agree?

 

Did you even watch those fights? Not a single one of those was a conclusive 'win'. He faked low blows in the Holyfield and Johnson fights. Golota floored him twice and Ruiz was deducted a point for holding/clinching yet he somehow despite this 6 point swing on the cards 'won' The Rahman fight set the compu-clinch record in a fight for something like 325 clinches. People see the Ruiz fight for what it was. Well, everyone except you it seems.