Carl "The Truth" Williams what if?

I think he had a trainer who worked with quite a few decent fighters, though I can't think of his name.. And his management had to be pretty good to get him in the ring with two great champions with less than 25 fights behind him. In the event that he achieved championship success its unlikely that he'd want to break up his team.. You know the old adage, " if it ain't broke, don't fix it. " Still a trainer like Steward, Dundee, Goosen, Duva or Benton might have helped him to shore up his defense some, but that's something we'll never know.

 

Had Williams dethroned Holmes I think it unlikely that Spinks would have been his next opponent. Carl didn't have the long time name recognition that Larry had, hence a Williams vs Spinks match would have meant less money, making the risk and hassles of jumping weight less palatable for Spinks. In addition, it was partially due to the noticeable deterioration of Holmes that prompted Spink's people to take that offer. Had they been looking at facing a young rising talent in his prime and for less money, I think Jinx would have stayed put at 175. Either that or retired.

 

Im a big fan but agree totally with Magoo who nailed it at the start of this.
Similar fighter to Ty Biggs and with similar strengths /weaknesses.
Biggs had Benton in his corner and couldnt cure his style flaws / sometimes guys just fight a certain way and don't learn or want to change.
Later in life he worked as a security guard and was on duty at fight venues at places where he was once top of the bill...how hard must that have been ?
Lost his daughter to leukemia then later died of cancer himself...he was only about 53 ish i think.
He was a fine athlete.
What really pushed him back down the pecking order was his defeat to Weaver / then when he managed to get another chance he ran in Mr Tysons left hook.
I remember towards the end he gave Bruno a hell of a fight until being stopped by a late barrage.

 

I felt that he should have at least been granted a rematch with Holmes, after losing by a hair, champ gets the benefit of the doubt 95 % of the time, and it seems as though Holmes was involved in A LOT of very close fights in his career, Witherspoon, Norton, Spinks, etc..

Feel bad for the truth guy had TOUGH LIFE, he lost his most important fights, then lost his daughter to leukemia, then ended up working as a security guard when his career was over, went from making half a mil for a nights work, to making chump change, probably 11-12 bucks an hour, then he passes at only 53 from throat cancer, life is cruel..

Even if he would have got the decision against Holmes he wouldn't have been on top to long because his punch resistance was to weak..

 

If Carl Williams had gotten the decision against Holmes - which I think he deserved, too - and faced Holmes in the rematch, I think he'd have done just fine.

I disagree that he would've faced Spinks, though.

Michael Spinks was happy being a light heavyweight. He was just running out of contenders. Don King offered Michael Spinks the Holmes fight because King wanted someone "easy" for Holmes to fight in order to tie Marciano's record. \

King's plan was for Holmes to finish his career fighting the light heavy champ (Spinks) - to tie Marciano's record - and then fight Alfonzo Ratliff - the WBC cruiserweight champ - in Holmes' 50th and record-breaking fight.

After beating the light heavy and cruiserweight champs ... and going 50-0, Holmes was supposed to retire as undefeated champ. Of course, Spinks screwed that up. (And Ratliff lost his title on the undercard.)

But there would've been no plan for Michael Spinks to fight for the heavyweight belt if Williams won the title in 1985. Spinks defended the light heavy belt twice that year. He had to work his butt off to add weight to become a heavyweight. It wasn't like he was too fat to make the light heavy limit anymore.

I think, if Carl Williams beat Holmes, that the big money fight for him in 1986 would've been against Gerry Co*ney. Both Williams and Co*ney were New Yorkers. Both were NY Golden Gloves champs. Co*ney had knocked off Phil Brown and George Chaplin in 1984, and he beat the ranked Eddie Gregg in 1986, and he would've been right there for a huge bout.

And, I think Co*ney's left knocks Williams out cold.

... Long story short, if Williams got the decision against Holmes ... GERRY CO*NEY becomes the heavyweight champion of the world.

I don't even know if Williams gives Holmes a rematch first. He might've fought Co*ney before Holmes.

 

I agree. Spinks wouldn't have been next. I don't even know if he ever moves up. If he did, he might've just gone to cruiserweight.

 

Williams didn't have a "bad" chin as some have stated. He had tendencies that he failed to correct. There was a tad of ****iness to his game up to and beyond the Weaver disaster. You'll note that heavy-handed experienced veterans or World heavyweight kingpins were the ones that stopped his game. Williams told me that by the time he was boned in the Morrison bout the fire and drive had all but waned. That "loss" broke his spirit.

If I recall Carl's actual words, there was not supposed to be a standing 8-count for that match. When Tommy went down he got one. When Carl hit the canvas he didn't get one...or something to that effect. I'll have to watch the match again. Its been 20 years.

RIP Carl.

 

Carmen Graziano.

I talked to him about Williams. He could never ever get the guy to bring his hands back to their proper position. And he dropped his right when he threw a left. And he kept those hands real low. Not enough head movement. He tried to get him to do those things but couldn't.

But the thing that bailed him out was a stiff jab--if it landed. If it misses he's right there for a right hand over the top. And the fact he was so tall when there weren't very many tall guys around, so he had that built in advantage. Nice left hook off the jab. But he didn't hit real hard and had to string together a ton of punches.

 

Thanks, and yep.. Every time he threw a punch he left the right side of his face wide open to a left hook.

 

What a tough sport. He does some things very well. In shape, good boxer. but the things he didn't do well.....

 

If he had shored up his defense and wasn't so plagued by inactivity during his prime, Williams could have gone further. The man had talent, ability and was one of the few 80's men who wasn't constantly on drugs, in trouble, etc..

 

Did anyone see Carl's fight with Tim Witherspoon? any details?

 

Great thread lads , wasn't Carl working as a security guard breathing in all that **** into his lungs on a nightly basis at Ground zero World Trade Centre prior to his death ?

 

Very close decision for Witherspoon from the reports at the time. I have never seen it, however.

 

Josey Wales...yes he worked at ground zero for 18 months/ but moved onto other assignments/ he became a manager at the security firm / by ordinary standards he actually had a decent and fairly well paid job / although nothing to compare to what he once did obviously.He himself admitted he screwed up in his peak years / poor money management/ divorce and all that goes with it.
He said Larry Holmes told him the importance of looking after the money / but like many fighters i suppose they think they are invincible at the time and dont look ahead 10 years.
Once youve been in the spotlight it must be hard having to do a mundane job.
He said often if someone asked 'arent you that boxer fella' he would say 'no..you're mistaken'.
Very sad...
Zadfrak is right about the faults in his style / like i said he was uncannily similar to Ty Biggs in that regard/ and nobody could get him to change either.