Marciano vs Matthews

Originally Posted by Mendoza View Post

Dempsey was in trouble on film and even admitted so. He went low several times in that round, and when Sharkey was hurt from the low blows and complaining to the ref Dempsey quickly launched a left hook. This fight should have been a NC or DQ.

Disputed? Bull . A doctor confirmed the blow was low. We have been over this before.

According to the Philadelphia Item ( Primary and local source ) , Jeannette was winning the fight until he was fouled.

According to the Boston Globe,Johnson fired several low blows and hit Jeannette when he was down from the low blows. So addition to the low blow foul, he hit a man while down. D-I-R-T-Y.

Depends on the rules. Legal at times perhaps. Not very sporting for sure

Johnson was caught hitting on the break vs Moran. A clear foul.

Johnson likely landed low punches on Ferguson, which is why he retaliated.

"Enraged by Johnson's insulting patter and left-hook to the belly, Ferguson took advantage of a bearhug by Johnson to drive his knee twice into his opponent's groin. Ferguson had taken the first two rounds, round three was even, but Johnson began driving home a wicked left hook to the stomach to take the fifth and sixth, and one or two may have strayed. "

An even fight with a journeyman type? Hardy world class stuff?!

Yes he did. The same Flynn years later somehow knocked Dempsey out in one round

In the Cuba fights post Willard, I posted the report vs Lodge it was reported by a docotr than Johnson once again went low.

The truth is Johnson went low in quite a few fights.

I agree he could be dirty. I just find you having too many double standards. Johnson and Dempsey could be just as dirty.

I posted numerous film, books and newspaper reports. You just can't accept them. They are all just lies to you. You read what you wish and disregard the rest. I find it hilarious that you are playing the objectivity card.

All you have to do is eliminate your own bias and double standards. Then you'll be fine. But we know that’s a near impossibility for you.

 

This thread is about MARCIANO V MATHEWS.

I have no interest in arguing with you further ,if you want to talk about the subjects you raised have the courtesy to start a separate thread on them.

 

McVey,

If you read the thread, I commented early on Marciano vs Matthews.

Then you stated to call Rocky a dirty fighter, and I just wanted to examine if you view the same for Dempsey or Johnson, who had their shares of low blows and fouls.

True to form you kept your double standard guard over those you like.

To add more to the topic of this thread, how about 10 minutes of footage?!

[url]https://archive.org/details/RockyMarcianoVsHarryMatthews[/url]

Fast froward to the 8:26 mark and you see the KO. Then see the 9:40 mark for the slow motion replay of the KO.

Remember you were the guy who said Marciano lacked one punch power.

 

I said Marciano was not an atg one punch hitter and I stand by that, he was a grinder koing a blown up lhvy in Mathews doesn't prove otherwise and I've seen the fight dozens of times, I bought it on a Black Hawk Rocky Marciano Super 8mm around 1970.

 

You said:

[url]http://www.boxingforum24.com/showthread.php?t=517387&page=7[/url]

You might want to check out the Walcott, Layne or Louis films to see what type of one punch KO power Marciano had.

 

I already told you I have these films, I've had them since before you were born.
Marciano was a grinder, he wore Layne down with a systematic
beating, likewise Louis whose legs went on him. Mathews was a light heavyweight.

You might want to check out Marciano's fights with Moore, Charlesx2,Lastarza x2, ****ell.
Marciano ruined fighters precisely because he relentlessly ground them down, not because he hit them with one shot and it was lights out. Walcott could have gotten up in their 2nd fight imo but chose the easy way out. Michael Nunn and Wilfred Benitez scored one punch kos over rated fighters ,were either of them true one- punch bangers?
Marciano was a great fighter he was also a dirty SOB and anyone disputing that is not dealing with reality.

 

I question his ONE PUNCH POWER based on the one punch kos he achieved that seems entirely reasonable to me -McVey

This thread is about assessing Marciano as a dynamite one punch ko artist,which I contend he was not. - McVey

Can you show me one heavyweight who KO'd guys cold as often as Marciano did. Louis, Layne, Walcott, Vingo...there could be more.

Sure Charles went the distance. You could say Marciano took a lot of Charles.

I agree that Rocky could be dirty. I just hold you in contempt because so could Dempsey and Johnson but you'll never admit that, which shows you allow clear bias to trump objective reasoning. Suit yourself. Let's keep it on boxing....

 

Layne was systematically broken down before the ko.
Louis was not ko'd by one punch it was a series of big shots. Vingo was kod after a volley of shots in a fight that had Marciano staggered three times.
Without looking it up, I bet you don't even know which punch finished Vingo.
I state Marciano as not a true one punch knockout hitter.
The May 1994 Ring rated the greatest 5 fighters of all time in their respective divisions.
At heavyweight it had;
1Ali
2.Louis
3.Johnson
4.Marciano
5.Dempsey

This is their appraisal of Marciano.

"Difficult to rate,he was the only unbeaten champion in history,which instantly separates him from the best of the rest, but his competition and length of reign,[only three years ,]are negatives .
Dethroned a 38 years old Walcott and defended against a 33 years old Charles,and light heavyweight champion Moore 41.
Possessed minimal natural talent and serves as undisputable proof that great heavyweights can be manufactured.
Work ethic was unmatched and heart was among the biggest.
Lacked the one punch crunch of Louis, but the accumulation of blows was as damaging as any heavyweight in history.
The bottom line would he have beaten Charles and Louis if they were younger?"

I've no comment on the rest of your remarks ,they have no place here.

 

McVey,

We are talking about his power here, not his skills. Why not ask Rocky's opponents if he can hit?

His Opponents:

Joe Louis, knocked out by Rocky in the 8th round, said of Marciano, "It hurt to bump into him....He hits harder than Max Schmeling...this kid is tough enough to beat anyone."

He also said, "The Rock didn't know too much about the boxing book, but it wasn't a book he hit me with. It was a whole library of bone crushers."

Jersey Joe Walcott, who lost his title to Marciano in a 13th round KO and a rematch in a 1st round KO, was asked who hit harder, Joe Louis or Rocky Marciano. "Joe could take you out with combinations...Marciano was a one-punch artist. He threw every punch like you throw a baseball, as hard as he could. I have to say, with all respect to Joe, Marciano hit harder."

Ezzard Charles "Rocky numbs you all over. Wherever he hits you, he hurts you; on the arms, the shoulders, the neck and the head."

Archie Moore (KO'd in 9th), when asked by reporters which of Marciano's punches hurt him, said, "Man they all hurt."
He also said, "After a fight with Marciano, it felt like you had been beat all over the upper body with a blackjack or hit with rocks."
"He could hurt you, sure, but it was the quantity of his punches. He just had more stamina than anyone else in those days. He was like a bull with gloves."

Roland LaStarza "I would throw a hard punch, then he would throw a hard punch. The difference was that Rocky would throw 10 more. He just never stopped throwing punches."

Harry "Kid" Matthews "He was a great puncher, one of the best of all-time. He just threw one punch after another, and all of them were hard."

"Dan, I can still feel his punches. He kept punching me in the upper arms until I could no longer hold them up to defend or throw punches". Phil Muscato, 5th round KO victim of Rocky, to his nephew Dan, many years after his fight with Marciano.(Thanks to Dan Muscato).

Bernie Reynolds (1952 opponent) "He had amazing strength. Any time Marciano hit you, he could hurt you. He didn't do much flicking; every punch was a knockout punch."

Other Fighters and Boxing Experts:

Floyd Patterson, who knocked out Moore for Rocky's vacated title said, "In the ring he looked sloppy and awkward sometimes, but that was deceptive because he was terribly strong, could punch and take a punch...Jersey Joe Walcott had made him miss for twelve rounds and then Rocky took his title away in the thirteenth. Ezzard Charles seemed to be making him look bad, but Rocky busted up his face something horrible...I respected Marciano"

Jack Dempsey, interviewed in the 1953 fall edition of Fight magazine said, "What everyone forgets is that Marciano can punch harder with a right hand than any modern-day heavyweight. In his first fight with Walcott, Rocky needed only one blow to win the title. The power in his right scrambled Jersey Joe's brains at Chicago."
"I've scored my share of knockouts along the way, but more often than not my opponents got up after being knocked down and had to be knocked down repeatedly. The same is true of Joe Louis. But Marciano needs only one solid smash and it's all over.
That's why I say Rocky Marciano is the hardest-hitting heavyweight champion I have seen."

>>>> Now after reading this, do you still think Maricnao lacked power? The fighters have spoken. They disagree with you. You can of course change your mind.

 

I have never said Marciano lacked power ,what I have said and I will say it till I die is that he was not a true one punch kayo artist. the underlined endorse my view ,he beat most of his opponents by grinding them down with punches that never stopped coming. I don't give a ******'s f*ck what your opinion is on any subject so why do you keep giving me it? Stop f*cking up threads with your twisted agendas.

 

Lol, your man Jack Dempsey said:

So Dempsey is saying Marciano had more one punch power than either himself or Louis. This is a Maricano thread, we know you dislike him.

I just find too many double standards you apply to boxers. That is the agenda.

-M

 

I'll make this short as my dogs need excercising.
I don't give a flying f* ck about you ,or your opinions /views/statements .
If you were brown bread I would have a drink to celebrate!
Now just f*ck off and stop bothering me you Moron.

 

.....ezzard charles told me rocky wasn't the hardest hitter he ever faced.....but was the strongest.

 

He wasn't the hardest hitter Moore faced either, he was a heavy duty banger no doubt, but he got most of his victims out with a non stop bombardment of an accumulation of punches over several rounds.
He had 5 title defences only one of which was a one punch ko and that was over a 39 years old man whom I think decided on the spot that discretion was the better part of valour. Marciano threw heavy punches in every round from the 1st to the last that's was his M. O.
That , the condition of a machine ,a disdain for punishment and a willingness to accept pain that is very rare,even among the brave men that pugilists invariably are.

 

Mcvey,

Marciano had all time one punch knockout power, especially prior to 1954 when he switched up his style(Thus shortening his punches, losing his roundhouse right knockout blow.) Prior to 1954, Marciano was one of the biggest one punch knockout artist in boxing history.



Look at what he does to Rex Layne here at his peak

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WotIszdTyDA[/url]
This is devastating

This is the same 22 year old Rex Layne who took brutal punching Bob Satterfields best for 8 rounds

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx5r381bpUY[/url]


Look at Rex Layne take all those right hands from Bob Satterfield, then look at what one Rocky Marciano roundhouse right does to Layne.