Should Floyd Patterson be criticized for for defending his title against

Harris--no, he was a decent contender,

but Patterson should have had another defense that year.

Frankly, I don't really understand why Machen had to fight Folley,

perhaps someone knows the politics behind that.

Machen seems to me to have earned the shot, period.

Folley--it is hard for me to see what he had done to that point which puts him above Harris, let alone aside Machen.

*on the other hand, Machen failed to beat Folley.

 

Not a chance. Folley and Machen were clearly better.

I think Machen actually had a shot to upset Patterson in a 15 round match.

 

Yes, he should be criticized. Or more like it, Cus should be. I really like Floyd, but aside from Machen and Folley, Sonny Liston was waiting around a long time for his shot. Floyd got away with an easy ride for awhile there.

 

On the face of it of Course machen and folley deserved title shots ahead of Radmacher and London but I understand the sequence of events. It just didn't pan out.

Folley never quite over shadowed machen and machen blew 3 elliminators during Floyd's time at the title. The draw with Folley. The knockout loss to Ingo and the draw with Williams. Then he lost to Harold Johnson and Liston during the Ingo serries then lost a vacant title fight with Terrell. Machen got his chances.

Folley blew his elliminator too. Then he lost to Cooper. by the time folley reversed that Cooper loss Liston beat him. He beat Machen during the Ingo serries when the title was basically frozen.. then Doug Jones knocked him out.

 

The Rademacher defense is probably the biggest disgrace of the sport's most high-profile title ever perpetrated.

 

Good post.

 

It was a silly fight. It was taken on the back of the Jackson fight without breaking camp. Just weeks later. I don't think it was at the expense of another contender really but of course Radmacher did not deserve that fight. I don't think he even got paid.

 

Patterson had an interesting career in the fact that he fought and defeated better fights post championship than he did as champion .. D'Amato is now enjoying some sort of saint like memory as the nice old man in Mike Tyson's life but in reality he was a very quirky guy and a control freak ... He had Patterson fight a terribly weak series of fighters in his first title reign and avoid all the top guys .. he then ducked Liston in a terribly embarrassing fashion .. in fact the Micky character from the Rocky films and his "handpicking" of Balboa's opponents as champ is all based on D'Amato ..

 

You have no idea what you are talking about. Cus D'Amato was waging a war against organized crime and the IBC and almost single handedly beat them or at least kept them at bay. Anyone who judges his actions in a vacuum and ignores that has no understanding of the 1950s boxing scene and the monopoly that the mob and the IBC controlled over the sport. People act like Don King and Bob Arum are bad but when the mob and the IBC control every single major venue and all of the national TV dates and all or most of the major titles you cant pretend that Arum or King or anyone else has ever had that kind of power in your lifetime. To boil that down to the idea that D'Amato was protecting Patterson is narrow minded at best. Nevermind that it totally ignores how and why the championship fights of Patterson came off and where his challengers were rated.

Even the idea that he ducked Liston in embarrassing fashion is horse****. A huge segment of the public did not want Liston anywhere near a title due to his criminal backyard (which continued well through his title reign) and his mob connections. Patterson, to his credit, took the high road and split from Cus in order to take that fight believing that Liston could reform (he didnt) and that his past shouldnt trump what he had accomplished in the ring. Even still there were plenty of people didnt want Liston anywhere near the top, and in fact he was banned in some locales from even fighting. So quit acting like that was some "shameless duck" without even looking at why that was happening.

 

No, he should not.

Rademacher-A publicity stunt fought less than a month after Patterson destroyed his #1 contender, Tommy Jackson.

Harris-#2 Foley and #1 Machen was to be an eliminator but they fought to a draw that got bad press. Next in line, Harris coming off a good win over #3 Pastrano was the logical choice.

London-A tune up against a top contender a month before Patterson was to face his #1 contender, Ingo. Had Machen not got blown out by Ingo, he would have been fighting Patterson that June.

McNeeley-a soft touch in-between Ingo and #1 Liston.

Patterson met his highest rated contender in summer bouts 2 out of 3 years of his first reign. The only time he missed is #1 was because he drew in an eliminator, leaving him with his #3.

Summer of 57-#1 Tommy Jackson
Summer of 58-#3 Harris
Summer of 59-#1 Ingo

In Patterson's second reign he managed 3 defenses in a little over a year, two were against his highest rated available contender. Ingo and Liston.

Patterson wasn't busy, but he made sure to get the top guy every year.

He faced 3 #1 contenders.

The only time he missed his #1 was Machen who blew an eliminator against the #2, and #1 Liston who was suspended, he would face his #2 to complete a Trilogy and challenge Liston later that year.

 

You are right on all accounts ... but Rademacher wasn't about fighting the mob. It was a mockery of the title.

 

It's clear you don't know what your talking about.

Your point is that Cus was the defender of the public and chose not to defend the title against far and away the top contender for the public's well being ? Are you serious ? He used that excuse to avoid a fight he knew his own fighter would be crushed in . His lack of belief in Patterson was one of the catalysts of their break up. If Cus was such a defender of the public's will and well being why didn't he care about the desire and public outcry for Floyd to fight a real contender instead of the handpicked soft touches he fed him prior to Ingo ? He ducked the best fighters for years. Where was his good will then ? Thwere was none. Cus finally had a heavyweight champion and he was not ever going to risk losing it if he did not have to. What defender of the integrity of the sport has his champion defend his title against an amateur ?

D'Amato was no saint. He was not nearly as bad as many but any romanticized notion that he was this above it all figure is childish. He was out for himself. Funny how you have no problem going on and on about the character of Jack Johnson for beating up someone but have no problem excusing Saint Cus for covering the young thug Tyson's ass time and time again during the Catskill days as Mike routinely beat up kids and ***ually harassed under aged women ... you think he did this for any reason other than protecting his own interests in getting a "next heavyweight champion" before he died ? Do you think this was in Tyson's best interests considering the life he went on to live? Want to explain why you'd excuse it to the parents of the women he ***ually molested while under Cus' guardianship and living under Cus' roof ? Ask Teddy Atlas who was there.