Jim Jeffries vs Sam Langford?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by StillWater, Jul 5, 2015.

  1. StillWater

    StillWater New Member Full Member

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    Let's say Jeffries gives Langford a crack at the title, who wins & how?
     
  2. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Langford weighed 155lbs when Jeffries was champion, he doesn't beat Jeffries .
    In 1908 ,3 years after Jeffries had retired Langford weighed inside the middleweight limit for a fight with Jim Flynn.


    The 180/185lbs Langford would have given Jeffries at least as much hell as the 180/183lbs, much cruder, half inch taller, Sharkey did for 45 rounds.
     
  3. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    True, and he also said " the only man I won't fight is Jim Jeffries"...
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Yes he said that when he himself was a small middleweight. Hardly surprising.
     
  5. SolomonDeedes

    SolomonDeedes Active Member Full Member

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    I've always found that really strange. Langford - or more likely his manager - puts an ad in the paper announcing his willingness to fight anyone but Jeffries. Why? Even given that he didn't think he could beat Jeffries, you'd think the money he'd have made would have compensated him for the bruises and anyway it's not like Jeffries was hammering on his door demanding a showdown.
     
  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    Langford might have beaten the Jeffries of Reno, but I think we would have to favor any earlier version over him.
     
  7. KernowWarrior

    KernowWarrior Bob Fitzsimmons much bigger brother. Full Member

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    'The Boilermaker' would likely have sent Langford to meet his maker.
     
  8. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I believe that Langford stated he never wanted to fight Jeffries.
     
  9. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    Langford who would fight anyone said Jeffries was more of a great bear than a man.
     
  10. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Pertaining to Jim Jeffries. Today he is rated so low in the pantheon of heavyweight champions by ESB posters who base his talents on his
    ludicrous fight with Jack Johnson in 1910, when after a six year layoff he was cajoled to fight a prime Jack Johnson by some sports writers, having to lose about 90 pounds on the process. How could ANY fighter look good on film
    after this stupid ordeal. ?. The fact is that with all these burdens Jim Jeffries
    was able to survive the cutting blows of Jack Johnson for 15 rounds under
    the hot sun of Reno Nevada at ALL... Today posters should take note that all the boxing writers, fighters, trainers of Jeffries time who saw him at his best and thought he was the greatest heavyweight they had ever seen. After all they saw him at his best ringside. Today 100 years later, who should know better they or some posters on ESB ?...
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Johnson said he felt he could have stopped Jeffries inside 8rounds had he tried to do so.This is in Pollack's volume 2 of Johnson.

    Jeffries had over a year to train for the Johnson fight and was down to 235/240lbs when Johnson fought Ketchel in October 1909, this from his own lips on his return from a health spa in Carlsbad.
    Delaney who trained Jeffries and was in Johnson's corner that day, said Johnson would have beaten Jeffries at any time of his career.

    Rickard who refereed the Johnson v Jeffries fight , the day after said Johnson was the best fighter who ever drew on a glove.

    Johnson named Fitz as the best fighter before himself.

    Corbett and Sharkey both named Johnson as the greatest defensive fighter they ever saw.

    William Muldoon who trained Sullivan and was in Jeffries camp at Reno said after the Johnson fight that Jeffries would
    never have been able to beat Johnson at any time in his career.

    Famous referee Jack Welch said
    "I am sure that Johnson could have beaten Jeffries when the white champion was in his prime.
    If Johnson fought the battle he did at Reno,Jeffries could never have beaten that black man , never in the days of his prime

    ". Charley White the back up referee for the fight said this of Johnson after the bout...
    "If he were a white man the public would accord him the title of the greatest heavyweight that ever donned boxing glove"
    .
    Langford named Dempsey as better than anyone before him.

    Hugh McIntosh famous promoter said after the fight;"Johnson told me he could have beaten Jeffries in the latters best day, now
    I believe it".
    Stanley Ketchel said of Johnson ,"there is no man in the world who has a chance with him."
    Jeffries was quoted in the San Francisco Evening Post July 6th 1910 as saying: " I don't know what it was,only that I never could have whipped him at my best".
    So Burt there are plenty of writers ,trainers and boxers who did not think Jeffries was the best.Oh, and you can throw in Nat Fleischer as well.
     
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    I find the fact that a 154lbs 21 years old Langford did not want to fight a 220lbs Jeffries unsurprising.
    Would Golovkin be happy to face Wilder?:huh
    Maybe Mayweather should have his last fight with Povetkin?:think
     
  13. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Mc, I am not implying that I think Jeffries could have beaten Jack Johnson at his best. But Jeffries in his prime was a feared and
    powerful ogre who was impervious to pain and punishment and
    might have beaten anyone at his peak. One never knows...
     
  14. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yipes, to think today that I a young fella along with my dad shook the hand of Jack Johnson in Huberts Flea Circus in NYC, a few years before his car crash in which he died, driving to the Joe Louis/ Billy Conn fight in 1946...
     
  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Like you I judge Jeffries on his whole resume Burt.
    I just took issue with your statement that everyone from his era acknowledged him as the best.
    After Reno there was some drastic revisionism by many experts.
    Adam Pollack has many excellent quotes to this effect in his vol 2 of Johnson The Reign.