Jess Willard defends his title 15 rounds vs Sam Langford and Harry Wills in 1915

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by SuzieQ49, Jul 11, 2015.

  1. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    37,088
    Likes Received:
    3,779
    Right after Willard won the title vs Johnson, Willard immediately drew the color line publicly. This effects his legacy greatly.

    Let's say Willard wasn't such a bad champion and actually fought his top contenders in 1915

    15 rounds how does he do vs Langford and wills?
     
  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    71,997
    Likes Received:
    28,008
    The guy that he really needed to fight, was Fred Fulton.
     
  3. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2006
    Messages:
    98,716
    Likes Received:
    30,652
    I don't think this is as straightforward as first glance might suggest

    By the end of 1915 Langford was 32, and dropping a few dec's.
    Wills most notable wins were a win over Langford in 15 and one over McVey the same year.He also lost to McVey in Dec that year and in Nov 1914 Langford knocked him out.
     
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    71,997
    Likes Received:
    28,008
    You don't have to look far to find contemporary articles criticizing Jack Johnson for not fighting Sam Langford, or Jack Dempsey for not fighting Harry Wills.

    I have never seen an article criticizing Jess Willard for not fighting Sam Langford or Harry Wills.

    The fight that everybody wanted to see seems to have been Willard Fulton.

    Other fighters who were discussed as possible challengers for Willard, include Frank Moran, Carl Morris, Battling Levinsky and Jack Dillon.

    It is a little surprising that Wills was not widely touted as a challenger, but I think it took a while for people to grasp how good he really was.
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2007
    Messages:
    114,824
    Likes Received:
    51,914
    Right. There was talk of Willard meeting Wills in an eliminator before Wills could meet Dempsey in his first defence though :lol:
     
  6. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2005
    Messages:
    58,747
    Likes Received:
    21,593
    Racial politics. Willard had done his bit for the white race by dethroning Johnson. The (white) press weren't ready to push forward a black challenger on Willard.

    I'd be surprised if articles criticizing Willard don't exist in the Baltimore/Washington Afro American newspapers .
     
  7. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    37,088
    Likes Received:
    3,779
    Why? wills was better
     
  8. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    71,997
    Likes Received:
    28,008
    We know that in hindsight, but Fulton had a better claim to a title shot, while Willard actually held the title.
     
  9. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    71,997
    Likes Received:
    28,008
    I am not sure that we can chalk it up to racial politics to be honest.

    The same newspapers that made no criticism of Willard, were very quick to criticize Dempsey for not fighting Wills.

    It seems that for whatever reason, the media were slow to cotton on to how good Wills was.
     
  10. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    37,088
    Likes Received:
    3,779
    How so who did Fulton best? Langford? Whom wills already beat multiple times
     
  11. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    71,997
    Likes Received:
    28,008
    The contemporary logic seems to have worked a bit like this:

    Fulton dominates Langford in a way that nobody has before, while Wills is still getting mixed results with him.

    He then makes a fairly clean sweep of the top white contenders, beating Weinert, Morris, Smith, McMahon and Moran.

    With no crystal ball to see Fulton's future losses, and Wills future wins, it is not hard to see why many people thought that Fulton was the best available contender.