the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Aye, laddie, I gathered as much from your input to the recent threads on the referendum on the 'other' forum.

I was just haven' a wee joke.

 

Holmes-Spinks 1

I had written a fairly long write-up of this fight through about 9 rounds, but then my 1 year old struck and turned off the computer before I saved it. Ah well.

I scored the fight 143-142 for Spinks, which matched two of the official judges, however I got there a much different way as all 3 judges gave Spinks the last round while I gave Holmes the final.

Here's how I got there -

Holmes - 1,2,5,9,10,12,15
Spinks - 3,4,6,7,8,11,13,14

I marked a number of the rounds as "close." Those included - 5,8,10,11,12,14

That's way more "close"rounds than I usually care to mark as such, as I really try hard to make a case for a winner of a round. Funny enough, if I switch the winner of all of those close rounds I come up with the same exact score for Spinks, 143-142

Like I said, I had a bunch of notes I would have liked to add and can only remember a few things.

Spinks seemed to be accusing Holmes of things that Holmes wasn't doing, including elbowing and rabbit punching. Spinks also seemed to randomly have outbursts of anger.

Throughout the fight, SRL mentioned Holmes wasn't throwing his right much. The boxrec write-up of this fight says that Holmes had a pinched nerve and was told by a specialist that he could become paralyzed if he continues to fight. Other doctors told him he had virtually zero chance of becoming paralyzed from the injury. If true, makes you wonder how much that was in his head. I had a very similar situation in another sport, and it's very hard to get the "p" word out of your head once you've heard it, even if others have said that it's highly unlikely.

If I had been watching this live, I believe my feeling would have been that I was just waiting for Holmes to eventually catch Spinks with a shot and eventually stop him.

Holmes was humble in the ring after the fight, but of course later that evening he dropped the famous "Marciano couldn't carry my jockstrap," line.

Merchant then called Michael, "Leon," during their post-fight interview.

Final thoughts - A very good small man found a way to beat a still pretty good big man. I think it's a great win, I don't know where I'd rate it all time, but Spinks made history with that win against a champion who makes a lot of top-5 all-time heavyweight lists. Having watched (and scored) a ton of Holmes fights in the last year or so on here I have to guess that the Holmes of the late 70's finds a way to beat this version of Spinks more often than not, but maybe Spinks' awkward style always would have caused Holmes trouble?

On to the rematch...

 

James Toney v James Robinson
Toney as a motivated crusierweight. Toney showcases all of his skills leading to a crushing 7th round left hook KO delievered from the southpaw stance. Masterful boxing and systematic break down of an opponent. I gave Toney every round execpt for the 2nd although you could argue perhaps Robinson won the third. The commentators seem to imply throughout the fight that James is losing or having real trouble, they even allow Robinsons corner man to be interviewed mid fight and he also expresses that Robinson is out-boxing Toney and won the first 4 rounds (really?) What fight are they all watching? Toney is like an apple bobbing in the ocean. His defense is so on point in this fight. Yes the early rounds weren't all action but Toney evades almost everything and is gliding around the ring in control. Toney allows Robinson to throw but its all to set up his power counter right hand which he unleashes from the 4th round onwards.

Robinson is no world beater but a solid, competent pro fighter who fought really tough guys (o'neil Bell, Ezra Sellers, Toney and Krzysztof Wlodarczyk). He has height and range from his southpaw stance.

Toney unfolds every little trick slowly. Rounds 1-2 head movement and nullify the southpaw jab. Toney is only touching him with the jab finding range and so comfortable in the pocket against. Robinson, who seems like he doesnt' have enough sting to really hurt Toney. Rounds 3-4 Toney steps up the pace, a few body shots and finds that a counter right is perfect over Robinson's lazy straight left (which is slow coming back). Toney drops him in the 4th - beautiful timed counter. Rounds 5-7 is a slow beat down with Toney switch hitting and banging away. In the 7th he even signals to the crowd that "he has this" and smashes a counter right then goes inside for the highlight finish. A great fight and shows Toney as a top 190lber I would argue among all time at that weight. Watching these type of performances shows what he can really do. One fight later he will fight Jirov and put on another masterful performance.

 

I watched joe bugner vs Winston Allen today not an all-time classic I know . it is though one of a few fights where bugner actually puts his weight into a punch . Big joe does an Ali standing over Liston pose in the post fight interview bugner says " I thought he deserved it and I'm glad he ate it " you just gotta find bugner amusing

 

Floyd Mayweather Jr. vs Jose Luis Castillo 1

4 rounds to 4
4 even rounds

Draw.



1. Castillo
2. Mayweather
3.Mayweather
4.Draw
5.Castillo
6.Draw
7.Castillo
8.Mayweather (-1 castillo)
9.draw
10.mayweather - 1
11.castillo
12. mayweather

115/115 DRAW.

sound OFF

 

Anyone have some heavyweight scorecards from 1940-present???

I am interested

 

Here is the Patterson-Quarry fights of '67. I scored it on the California system which is 1 point for the winner of a round (an additional point for a knockdown), no points for even rounds.

Patterson-Quarry I

Round 1: Even-no points
Round 2: Quarry (2 knockdowns) 3 points
Round 3: Patterson
Round 4: Patterson
Round 5: Patterson
Round 6: Even
Round 7: Patterson (1 knockdown) 2 points
Round 8: Patterson
Round 9: Quarry
Round 10: Quarry

Patterson 6-5

Patterson-Quarry II

Round 1: Patterson
Round 2: Quarry (1 knockdown) 2 points
Round 3: Quarry
Round 4: Quarry (1 knockdown) 2 points
Round 5: Even
Round 6: Quarry
Round 7: Even
Round 8: Patterson
Round 9: Patterson
Round 10: Patterson
Round 11: Quarry
Round 12: Patterson

Quarry 7-5

 

Thanks a lot! :good

 

Suz, I have a few more for the dates you mentioned. Here is the second fight between Ernie Terrell and Cleveland Williams scored on Philly's 5 point must system.

Round 1: 5-4 Terrell
Round 2: 5-4 Williams
Round 3: 5-4 Williams
Round 4: 5-4 Terrell
Round 5: 5-4 Williams
Round 6: 5-4 Terrell
Round 7: 5-5 Even
Round 8: 5-4 Terrell
Round 9: 5-4 Terrell
Round 10: 5-4 Williams

46-45 Terrell

 

Here's another one for you Suz, a fight that nagged at me for years was the Trevor Berbick-Renaldo Snipes fight. I saw it when it happened and although I didn't score it, I felt Berbick had done enough to win. I was in the total minority with some people at the time that also watched it, but like then, I seemed to be more impressed with the short jolting punches Berbick would throw while infighting. I read on a message board someone commenting on this fight that they too had Berbick winning so I thought I would check it out again. The fight tends to get sloppy as they tire and there are some subjective rounds that could go either way such as rounds 5, 9 and 10, so I really don't have a problem with the decision or if anyone else scores in Snipes favor. The scoring is on a rounds basis, no extra point for the knockdown unless the fight is scored a draw such as Mercante's card and then they go to supplemental scoring, in which an additional point for the knockdown can be employed.

Berbick - Snipes

Round 1: Snipes (scored a knockdown)
Round 2: Berbick
Round 3: Snipes
Round 4: Berbick
Round 5: Even
Round 6: Berbick
Round 7: Berbick
Round 8: Snipes
Round 9: Even
Round 10: Berbick

5-3-2 Berbick

 

Here's another heavyweight scorecard. I know it's a controversial fight, but here is the way I saw it. Cassius Clay v Doug Jones

Round 1: Jones
Round 2: Clay
Round 3: Clay
Round 4: Jones
Round 5: Jones
Round 6: Even
Round 7: Clay
Round 8: Jones
Round 9: Clay
Round 10: Clay

5-4-1 Clay

 

Here are my last two heavyweight scorecards. The first is Ali-Chuvalo II. There was no controversy at the time but somehow there have been rumors infiltrating the system that Chuvalo was robbed and like all rumors, it's gained momentum. So here it is (IMO), scored on the 5 point must system.

Muhammad Ali vs. George Chuvalo II

Round 1: Ali - 5-4
Round 2: Ali - 5-4
Round 3: Chuvalo - 5-4
Round 4: Ali - 5-4
Round 5: Ali - 5-4
Round 6: Ali - 5-4
Round 7: Chuvalo - 5-4
Round 8: Ali - 5-4
Round 9: Ali - 5-4
Round 10: Chuvalo - 5-4
Round 11: Ali - 5-4
Round 12: Ali - 5-4

Total 57-51 Ali

Chuvalo had his moments but he couldn't keep an attack sustained. He would flurry, but then Ali was gone hitting George with rapid combos once again. George did well, but it's just an urban myth that he was robbed.


And the last one, the 1972 Patterson-Bonavena fight here. Rough fight on the scorer because Patterson throws sharp punches, but just not very many. Understandable at 37. Bonavena actually fights a controlled fight with Gil Clancy in the corner and most of his work is done with his typical wildman pummeling on the inside. Anyways, here we go.

Round 1: Even (not much is done)
Round 2: Even (ditto)
Round 3: Bonavena
Round 4: Bonavena (Oscar scores a knockdown)
Round 5: Bonavena
Round 6: Patterson
Round 7: Bonavena
Round 8: Patterson (very close-if anyone scores this even or for Bonavena I wouldn't blink an eye)
Round 9: Patterson
Round 10: Patterson

Now, this is scored on NY rules which is simply a rounds basis, which my card is obviously 4-4-2 a draw. However, NY also employs the supplemental system in the event of a draw, which allows me to score the fight 5-4 in Bonavena's favor due to the 4th round knockdown. I'd love to see anyone else's score on this one.

 

Thanks a lot

I had it 6 rounds to 4 Williams, very close fight