The Phenomenon Of The Terrible First Round-Does It Lead To Bad Judging Of The Match?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by CST80, Jul 26, 2015.


  1. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    In my personal opinion I think the way a first round plays out can a effect the way the entire match is perceived in the eyes of the fans and judges alike. When you see a fighter especially a popular one get badly hurt in the first round when no one expected it that changes the tenor of the match, it effects our mindset because it makes us think that every shot that's landing on the hurt fighter for the next few rounds will be the shot that puts him down and gets him out of there. We are anticipating the fighter will be stopped in some fashion, so therefore it changes the way we perceive it and clouds our judgment when scoring. But the reality is many times the hurt fighter wins the second or third or fourth rounds usually all close but are not given credit for it, because we're not seeing the fight as clearly as we should. We give the fighter far too much credit in the ensuing rounds sometimes far more than he deserves.

    A few examples Froch-Groves 1 the fact that Groves this "nobody" to most non British fans dropped the iron chinned Froch, that shocked most fans to their core and even the British commentators, so it affected how the match played out to most fans especially in their minds. Everyone thought Froch who was put down by Groves straight right would surely go down from one of the multitude of follow up rights Groves landed in the subsequent rounds, so they all judged the majority of the match in Groves favor while he was dominating the early rounds, Froch started doing much better in the middle rounds, possibly stealing a few half way through and eventually won by controversial TKO. The match wasn't nearly as one sided as fans thought it was but that first round was hard to mentally overcome, their judgement was clouded.

    Bradley-Provodnikov, Tim was hurt so badly in the first two rounds that caused everyone watching to sit in anticipation waiting for the eventual Knockout shot from Ruslan that would follow, yet it never came and all the while fans were waiting and in some cases hoping, they weren't seeing Bradley boxing Ruslan's ears off while on the backfoot. It was a close fight but Timmy won it, but the first two rounds messed with everyone's heads. Granted the missed KD wouldn't have had an effect on the judges cards, so that was a bad call.

    Algieri-Provodnikov, Algieri went down once from a huge shot to his eye and then took a knee to clear the cobwebs. So everyone thought it was only a matter of time before this unknown nobody gets put down for good, yet the follow up knockdown never came, but judgment was clouded and fans gave many of the following rounds to Ruslan that he did not deserve at all, an argument could be made that Algieri outworked him in the last 11 rounds and swept the scorecards but most fans thought it was far closer than it actually was.

    Pascal-Gonzalez, Jean was hurt pretty badly from a few shots Yunieski landed on him in the first round almost out on his feet at times, but in the following round Jean kept his cool and was slipping many of Yunieski's shots by ducking low and catching the main impact either on the back of his neck or between his shoulder blades, those were not scoring shots, meanwhile in the exchanges Jean slipped many shots while landing the cleaner work, but the fans not seeing clearly because they thought Jean was done for, gave Yunieski many close rounds that he didn't fully deserve.

    Pacquiao-Marquez the worst first round to end all bad first rounds. JMM was dropped 3 times, meanwhile he outboxed Manny for the remainder of the match but at least he got the Split Draw, because the judges didn't let the events of the first round hamper their perception of the fight all that much.


    Do you agree or disagree that this happens frequently? Share your thought and examples.
     
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  2. Xelloss

    Xelloss Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think there is something to this.

    Also on the flip side, I think sometimes a name fighter who has a terrible first round - but does better in subsequent rounds can be unfairly given those rounds. Because they just look so much better by comparison.

    Objective judging of anything is hard. Human brain is naturally and by design influenced by what has come prior. This is why hitting professional level pitches in baseball is so hard. Trying to hit a changeup after looking at a couple fastballz can throw off the timing of the most talented batter.
     
  3. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think anyone who values their own opinion as a fight scorer should be able to compartmentalize each round.

    I wouldnt classify it as a phenomenon without more than a few examples spread over a number of years, although I'm sure there are more. I really see a few fights where a guy gets his lunch handed to him in the 1st and recovers to be able to make a very competitive fight of it, win or lose.
     
  4. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    I agree with this. Not just for first rounds but any stretch of the fight. It's especially evident when the fighter who hurt the other remains (ineffectively) aggressive in the following rounds. Affects judges, commentators, fans--everyone.
     
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  5. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I do think there is something to the idea that people fall victim to their own expectations at times.

    I also think people also may fall victim to confirmation bias, as well as sympathy rounds looking to "even things out".

    One thing I think is definitely a phenomenon is people scoring a round in comparison to previous rounds. E.g. Fighter A got blasted in rd 1, does better but not good enough in rd 2, but gets the round simply because it wasn't as bad as the previous round.

    There was an old thread FAQs of scoring that we discussed alot of this stuff. Great thread.
     
  6. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    That's the problem though most fans aren't clear headed and in the moment enough to not be effected by the one or two disastrous rounds.
     
  7. theanatolian

    theanatolian Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I completely agree. I've been telling people who claim Provodnikov was robbed against Bradley that dominating the first and last rounds does not mean winning the fight, they need to watch rounds 2-11 without the first round bias. Timmy won that fight.You may also add last round in this case.
     
  8. OvidsExile

    OvidsExile At a minimum, a huckleberry over your persimmon. Full Member

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    I think most of the time the popular fighter is gifted the first two or three rounds just out of expectation and because the opponent hasn't done anything yet to change people's opinions. If you are the underdog in the fight you have to be more dramatic and prove you won every round or risk getting robbed when people see what they expect to see. All the close rounds go to the name fighter. I see it over and over. Once an opponent puts the name on the seat of his pants, he has the respect of the audience and the judges and they start to view the fight with more objectivity. The earlier the opponent can make his mark, the more likely a fair score will be rendered.
     
  9. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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  10. the factor

    the factor Active Member banned Full Member

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    Fans and admittedly some lesser judges can be swayed by this phenomenon but good judges are trained to ignore what happened in previous rds and what might happen in consequent rds. They also score the rds to either red or blue corner and ignore the names and reputations of those who occupy them.
     
  11. ellerbe

    ellerbe Loyal Member Full Member

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    :finger5:finger5 no way in hell Algieri won or dominated the last 11 rounds.
     
  12. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    ....... Officially.
     
  13. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    Pretty close to it. So :nutcase
     
  14. chacal

    chacal F*** the new normal Full Member

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    You scored 7-3 to pascal that fight. You are the phenomenon, man.:good
     
  15. CST80

    CST80 De Omnibus Dubitandum Staff Member

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    6-4 I changed round 3 to Gonzalez after the fact, unlike official judges I have that luxury:deal