the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.


  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    JAMES TONEY D12 MIKE MCCALLUM

    I hate judging Toney fights. Hate it. McCallum, still fast as a ****, he knows when to jab doesn't he? Toney is countering that punch for lunch but I don't know how he'll get on here. He knows when there's a second jab on, everything. Toney is jabbing more than usual which is good but he'll need to find that extra punch i think to win this. He sets off out-jabbing McCallum in 2 though, and he is finding that extra punch! He's doing great work when they bump up. I think the KD at the end of the round that was not called a KD, I am happy it was not called a KD. Either call is fine.

    My sense after that second was that Toney could take control with aggression if he was a bit careful, but McCallum finds some GREAT punches and the round feels very much in the balance. McCallum looks to move a bit more I think; Toney is still propping up his offence with a great jab though.

    Fourth, one of the great middleweight rounds, absolutely exceptional stuff and so so close. I thought Toney had it put to bed with a right hand right uppercut right hand combo with a left hook not too far behind but McCallum comes back strong. Even round, Toney sneaks it if someone must. McCallum jabs his way to the fifth, conservative, backpedalling, Toney is missing with the right all of a sudden. It's a great adjustment because McCallum looked a little lost a couple of times to the right hands the round before.

    McCallum is jabbing his way to the sixth, too, and IMO probably a very good chance at winning on my card, until Toney hits him with four consecutive round hands, the first of which buckled his knees. But I'm not sure this is sustainable by Toney. He needs to score so many rights to equalise the McCallum jab. I reckon if anyone tags two rounds together in a row from now they'll probably get it for me.

    These guys are hurting eachother. I forgot how hurtful this fight was, a lot of hard punches going in. After eight I have it 4-4 and I have a sense that McCallum is fading a bit...that proves to be BS as he out-jabs Toney completely in the ninth in which he is almost completely dominant. Perhaps it's no coincidence that he starts to find the body in earnest in this round. He is genius at making space for himself on the inside and finding a punch. Big round coming up. Toney feels that way too; he comes out extremely aggressively and lands several hard right hands, again buckling Toney's knees. They are just exchanging rounds, taking turns to push. McCallum survives the hurt calmly and by employing good mobility.

    I don't know what to do about round 11. McCallum outlands Toney with the jab but one or two right hands make for an impact. I think i'll shade it to McCallum who probably shades the body exchanges. But that underlines the importance of rules because this eleventh should be even. If it's even, anyone can with the fight on my card. But because I shade it to McCallum in keeping with the rules only McCallum can now win the fight.

    Toney does the damage in the twelfth though - if he'd dropped the boy, he'd have taken the fight and if he'd been awarded the KD in the second he'd have taken the fight.

    So, another ****ing draw :lol: This one was a great, great fight though.


    Toney:2,4,6,8,10,12
    McCallum:1,3,5,7,9,11,

    114-114.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    James Toney MD12 Mike McCallum

    Yeeaaaaaaaaaaah, Toney. I used to love James Toney. He's great in the opening round. He sets out to out-jab McCallum but that doesn't just mean beating an older fighter to the punch for him, no, instead he is aggressive when McCallum throws his own jab, attacking the body with both hands and then spinning off. He very much out-McCallum's McCallum. Round two is significantly closer though, but this is, by my reckoning, the first time anyone in this series has taken two in a row. Toney is making the difference with speed and aggression.

    The third is desperately close, but i'm giving it to Toney too. McCallum takes an early lead with a beautiful right uppercut to the torso, and maintains his lead with single lefts, but Toney eventually pegs him back with a combo of his own and a couple of nice single shots approaching bell. Big fourth coming up...McCallum finally banks one. Can't see him making it back if he loses that round, he is just looking for the right more behind his jab, giving Toney a bit more to think about, taking chances that he naturally didn't want to take in the first. I wish he would get in close again move his man around, but that's a start for the 35 yr old.

    McCallum boxes beautiful through the first two minutes of the fifth. It's almost like they have switched places - Toney is jabbing and Mike is the one reacting aggressively, while behind his jab he looks for another punch. But Toney takes it away from him with a lovely right uppercut to the point of the chin followed by a one-two. Big sixth...another desperatly close round but i'll give the round to McCallum based upon his very late bodywork. This keeps him on Toney's coattails going into the second half of the fight. He prods his way to the seventh, too, he's succeeded in taking the sting out of James which is allowing him to jab more.

    An even round! McCallum wins the round with aggressive punching but has a point deducted for a beauty: put Toney in a headlock with his left, and then hit behind his own back into Toney's face with his right. Magic, but it costs McCallum tying it up.

    This is one of the worst commentaries i've ever heard for a fight btw. He calls lefts rights, rights lefts, seems to think a very close fight is being dominated by McCallum (and probably that the sun shines out of McCallum's ****) and insists with about half of the ninth gone that Toney has "less than three rounds" to turn things around :lol:

    He's right about McCallum looking tired at the end of the the ninth, but McCallum has looked tired before and recovered in the minute between rounds. Toney is in trouble; he hasn't won a round since the fifth. All square going into the tenth.

    Tenth is just desperately close. Score it any way you like. I'm going to score it for Toney who went a little longer in the box seat in this round, I think. But it's arbitrary really. Big eleventh on my card...and it's another absurdly close one. McCallum lands good body punches. Toney lands more shots than McCallum upstairs...but you just don't know what to do with them? I'm going to give it to McCallum because I gate Toney the last round and it was mad close too.

    Last round decider.

    Ach, I can't split them. I'll call it even. Then the fight is even. That was too hard to score, these guys are too well matched.



    TONEY:1,2,3,5,10,
    MCCALLUM:4,6,7,9,11,
    EVEN:8*,12

    McCallum has a point deducted.

    5-5-2 Draw.
     
  4. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    James Toney SD12 Dave Tiberi


    TONEY:1,4,6*,7.
    TIBERI:2,3,5,8,9,10,11,12

    * Tiberi has a point deducted for a low blow.

    More even through five than I remember it...the fifth was really really close, I would like to score it even tbh.

    Oh dear - I have it 115-112 for Tiberi.
     
  5. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I haven't scored it recently but good to see someone have Toney level or leading, he was walking Nunn down and doing damage early as you note. Enough of the 'come from behind none sense', the same to a lesser extent with Chavez Taylor.
     
  6. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Hurt Toney, too a bit, that talk. I've watched a lot of fights from this era at MW and they talk about that over and over again like Toney hasn't really beaten him or something.
     
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Mike McCallum SD12 Sumbu Kalambay

    Kalambay looks a little quicker, both of them jabbing so well, I think McCallum is just trying to get set, he's wasting nothing, he's walking Kalambay down and rather than getting his own range he's getting Kalambay's. Or that's my impression. He has him cornered at bell. As expected he corners him in the second too - finding him with the jab now and knowing where he is for the second punch. Nobody has a better feel for the killzone than Mike when he finds it and he's found it early here. Not that Kalambay is out of the fight. He is compact in his own punchzone, firing harder punches but generally being made to miss.

    Kalambay comes roaring back in the third. He knows where McCallum is too. In a way these two are balancing economy against one another. Who is more willing to take more risks and will they pay off? But - McCallum rides the punches Kalambay chances. It's not worth the risk for him because he is marginally out fought. Maybe a key round.

    Great fourth from McCallum. That pressure boxing, when it unwinds a technician it's pretty awesome to watch it happen and it's happening now. He's outleading and then he's countering any Kalambay work, especially with that cuffing left. Kalambay can't get his jab working the same. It's like McCallum knows how he moves now but there is a drop off on footspeed too in Kalambay's case? Or is McCallum just crowding him with pressure?

    Outstanding fifth - incredible round, both of them were brilliant. It seems an even round was scored by a couple of judges in this fight - so I get to score one. It's this one. They were both brilliant in that round. Mike, when he corners guys and he comes square to go to the body, he likes the right first sometimes and the left, the speed with which the left comes to the body is just absurd. It's like one punch is ethereally stitched to the other.

    Sixth is crucial I feel and McCallum just about crowds Kalambay out of it despite an interesting foraging left hook from Kalambay that lands twice. Kalambay springs his attack one round late, in the seventh, and it's good, picking his shots staying mobile hitting Mike before Mike tracks him down, when he has previously been looking for space maybe. It suits him and he lands jab and rights several times, up and down too. He bosses this round. This is still early enough to be interesting - if he can recreate that in the eighth suddenly things are close.

    He's not quite as good but he does win the eighth. He's finding McCallum with workrate which failed in the second. It's a big effort though and I expect to see him flag soon - if he doesn't, I think he'll win on my card though. All McCallum's real success in that round was to the body - I reckon he'll go there now. I'm wrong though - it's only in the last forty seconds that he goes to the body and he's so dominant I can't believe he won't try to get the body attack going before he brings Kalambay in. He waited there. He shouldn't wait now, I have it dead even. Kalambay is moving more but no longer trying to move his way out of trouble, that's the difference. He moves when he's NOT in trouble, and punches when he is. And that's working. Big tenth coming up.

    Round comes alive at the end when McCallum gets Kalambay to the ropes where he leads and Kalambay ditches over and over again while keeping it close with the counterpunches. I think McCallum has stopped the rot here with aggression and workrate. Kalmabay outworks him in return in the eleventh though, mainly with the left-hand. The fight has such a different flavour since the seventh, it's literally in two halves this fight. If Kalambay had lit upon his solution in the fourth he would have won. Twelfth for all the marbles.

    ...I have Kalambay winning the fight.

    McCallum:2,3,4,6,10,
    Kalambay:1,7,8,9,11,12
    Even:5,

    6-5-1 Kalambay.

    The official scorecards are 116-114, 116-115 and 114-115 in favour of McCallum. Absolutely classic fight, I'm happy with any one of three scores.
     
  8. YesMySon

    YesMySon Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Hey Guys! I'd love to hear the opinion on my scorecard of

    OSCAR DLH VS FLOYD MW JR!

    I saw oscar at his very best in this fight. His defense was on par and he gave Floyd a lot of trouble. I noticed he tried to fight him a lot like JLC, but unlike Castillo he wasnt active enough to close the gap. I like to watch it with sound, and I noticed whenever Lampley said a punch for oscar landed, Manny Stew said it didnt really, but also when floyd landed something they would say the same thing. I spent a lot of time telling Steward, Lampley, and Merchant to STFU many times. I was suprised to see Merchant actually be the one to give both fighters the right credit at the right time.


    1. Floyd Mayweather Jr.
    2. Oscar De la hoya
    3.DRAW
    4. OSCAR
    5.FLOYD
    6. DRAW
    7.FLOYD
    8. OSCAR
    9. FLOYD
    10. FLOYD
    11 FLOYD
    12. DRAW

    Old School: 6 rounds to 3, 3 even, FLOYD MAYWEATHER JR.

    10 POINT MUST - 116 - 114 WINNER FLOYD MAYWEATHER JR.
     
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Mike McCallum SD12 Herol Graham

    Great aggressive start from Graham. Great stuff. Direct, fast, turns beautifully but McCallum creeps in in the second. I'm interested to see how he adjusts to take Graham on.

    It's more just the same old McCallum. He's just uncovered the zone in which he can hit Graham and off he goes. No different to any other foe.

    Even after eight though - it's interesting.


    MCCALLUM:3,4,7,8**,9,11,12
    GRAHAM:1,2,5*6,10,

    Good, close, tough, dirty fight. 114-112.

    *McCallum slips on water, the referee mistakenly calls a KD.
    **Graham has a point off for throwing McCallum into a turnbuckle :lol:
     
  10. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    McGrain, I scored this one as well. We agreed on 9 of the 12.

    Round 1: 10-9 Graham
    Round 2: 10-9 Graham
    Round 3: 10-9 McCallum
    Round 4: 10-9 Graham
    Round 5: 10-8 Graham - The ref scored that as a knockdown. I don't agree, I think it was a slip but it was scored as such.
    Round 6: 10-10 Even
    Round 7: 10-9 McCallum
    Round 8: 10-9 McCallum - I scored it even but one point deducted from Graham makes it 10-9.
    Round 9: 10-9 McCallum
    Round 10: 10-9 McCallum
    Round 11: 10-9 McCallum
    Round 12: 10-9 McCallum

    115-113 McCallum - A tough fight to score, but it was the latter rounds that won it for McCallum on my card. They were both tiring, especially in the 11th and 12th, but McCallum's punches just had that much more pop to them.
     
  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Nine is more like it!
     
  12. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Bobby Czyz SD10 Leslie Stewart

    I remember watching this one on ESPN live when it happened, but never scored it. Same story as with most of Czyz's efforts around that time; starting off strong, landing nice, crisp combinations only to gas in the second half of the fight and let his opponent come on strong.

    In this case, it was particularly galling because the by then shopworn Stewart could have stolen a round or two had he just thrown any goddamn punches in the first few rounds, but he seemed more concerned with posing. His loss.

    Czyz took the first five on my card, scoring with short hooks and right hand over the top. Then he slowed the attack as he always did in the middle rounds and Stewart began to string together some nice jab-right hand combinations, taking rounds six and seven. The momentum really swung toward Stewart when late in round eight he connected with a short right as Czyz came inside and Bobby went down. He was definitely shaken up but the bell saved him.

    Round nine featured the jab and purposeful movement Stewart should have been showing all along, and he took the round from a now passive Czyz. To his credit, Bobby came on and "out-busied" Stewart in the final stanza, smartly coming inside and gluing himself to Stewart's chest, where the long jabs and right hands would bear no effect. He took the round and it won him the fight, at least on my card. 95-94 Czyz.
     
  13. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Very hard fight, I come up with a different scorecard every time.

    Probably the best two-way technical fight on film IMO. Or at least as good as Charles-Johnson.
     
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Look who decides to come back! Just waltzes in and proclaims too!
     
  15. Brixton Bomber

    Brixton Bomber Obsessed with Boxing banned Full Member

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    Over the next week or so?

    Got any fights in mind that you need to re-watch or discover for the first time? Also, got any fighters that you wouldn't mind watching more of or some of for the first time?