John L Sullivan punching power vs Bob Fitzsimmons?

Mitchell's bout with Mike Cleary was with gloves.

 

Sullivan was no Max Baer .. Sullivan was lightning fast and highly skilled naturally .. I forget which one, either Fitz or Choynski said Sullivan was a harder puncher than they were and stated it from first hand observation .. either way it is a huge statement given that post Sullivan, pre Langford those were the two hardest hitters in the fight game .. I'd go w Sullivan as well but Fitz was one of the hardest hitting pound for pound guys that ever lived ..

 

I like how everyone says this and that about Sullivan of his actual skills being how fast or strong,how skilled?There is simply no evidence of this and really more like a comic book character when it comes down to it,how good do you want him to be is the best answer.i would go by his OWN words that boxers became better than his time and he thought Jefferies was the most advanced thing he ever saw.

 

There is a wealth of eye witness testimony regarding Sullivan's style and attributes.

We could pretty much rebuild him from the ground up!

As for his statement that later fighters were more advanced, I think that some people are in indecent haste to latch on to this comment that gives them what they want, while ignoring everything he said on the subject.

 

he probably was pretty fast. on the other hand he probably fought a chain of petrified bums for the most part too, and avoided some great fighters via the color bar.

 

Many people seem to think there was little or no boxing at the time, due to them not being listed at boxrec.

 

Furthermore Sullivan was effectively finished after the Cardiff fight in '87 due to injury and ill-health/drinking. I actually think his lay-off before the Corbett fight was a greater impediment than Jeffries' was v Johnson.
In his pomp he dodged no-one, Slavin, Jackson, Corbett all came at the tail-end.

 

True, and Jeffries wasn't a fancy Dan type of boxer. So if Jeffries was light years ahead, Sullivan must have been as crude as a tough man.

In Sullivan's day they just went at each other. Hitting power, stamina, and durability often decided who won a man, not skills, defense, foot work ring generalship, etc...

Sullivan also fought in a weak era that had few punchers, so his power must have really stood out.

 

I don't get all these historians who big him up ,don't they realize he didn't even know what a jab was really or how he would be totally confused with even an average one?I don't consider Sullivan in any era,it was simply the start of rules boxing ,you cannot say or evaluate Anyone without video footage its that simple.

Theres was even such a moronic post on here that had him beating klitchko,the scary thing is some posters actually believe that,talk about being dumbed down...:-(

 

yea he said they had surpassed him,he didn't or couldn't comprehend the simplest of footwork!!

 

fitz's appearance on his available fight films do no justice for that claim

 

Originally Posted by janitor View Post
They were two of the best finishers of all time, but they were different kinds of finisher.

Fitzsimmons was a trap setter who awaited his opportunity, while Sullivan sailed in and took his opponent out of the game as quickly as possible.

I would guess that Sullivan probably had more power in absolute terms, because his opponents seem to have been discouraged as soon as he touched them.

Eastpaw,

Yes the films do give Fitz justice. Fitz set a trap for Corbett. It can be seen on film. Landing cleanly on Corbett's head was difficult, so Fitz feinted high with one hand, drawing Corbett's guard up, then quickly delivered the KO body shot with the other.

The blow appeared to hit Corbett on the floating rib area. Right on the button as they say. Corbett tried to get up but the blow paralyzed him for more than 10 seconds.

 

Name me a great fighter of either color that he avoided during his prime?