Jack Johnson vs Mike Tyson

I can see a couple of things that have been lost over the years.

The poverty that fighters like Jack Johnson and Joe Walcott operated under early in their careers, forced them to adopt styles of boxing that emphasised economy of effort. You don’t really see that in the heavyweight division any more.

You don’t really see hard punching defensive specialists any more, outside of the superheavyweights. Fighters like Johnson, Schmeling, and Walcott, would have been developed as offensive specialists today.

 

Yes there was. His competition. The footage of those guys shows very primitive skills, very primitive single shot attacks, and the better of the fighters he faced were physically inferior to the 6 foot 180-210 pound Johnson. That would not be the case against a prime Tyson who was only an inch or so shorter and at least as strong, if not stronger.

 

OK so what would we expect to see on film?

Were they regarded as boxing geniuses of their era?

Burns was seen as a brilliant technical infighter, and this is upheld in his other fights, but Johnson just takes his game away.

Ketchel and Flynn, seem to have been regarded as being at the less technical end of the spectrum. I will admit that neither impresses.

McVea was seen as more of a puncher, but he still displays some skills on film.

You have to consider the possibility that you might be looking at Shannon Briggs, and judging te technical skills of the era based on him.

 

I don't think Johnson is primitive tbh. I think his punch output is horrifically low but that is more to do with the era he fought in.

 

its weird without "foxy" around to pollute Tyson threads with his hate claiming that anyone that approved of Tyson was subhuman and approved of ra-pe etc :huh :-( :nono

I think Tyson would beat Jack Johnson, imo, its a "guess" but that's my guess. Not because I think Tyson was or wasn't a bad fella but just because I think he would win. That speed from a power hitter was shocking for our time and that was 30 years ago.

 

The best that you can ever do is to make your best prediction based on the evidence available.

These threads are nothing more than a search for the prediction that best fits the evidence.

 

yes and in a sport whereby one well timed punch can change everything :bbb

 

I'll go with Johnson by decision in a fun fight to watch. Tyson never beat anyone that impressed me anymore than Johnson's opponents.

 

Larry Holmes, Tony Tubbs, Razor Ruddock, Frank Bruno, Bonecrusher Smith, Tony Tucker, Mike Spinks, Pinky Thomas look like McVey or Burns or O'Brien or Ketchell or a 100 year old Jeffries exactly how?

Here's some footage of arguably the best heavyweight Johnson ever beat. Devastating stuff...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pay6XBYfnRc

 

I didn't say they looked a like I just said they didn't impress me anymore. Yes, Johnson's competition looked unskilled but Tyson's all looked to scared to do anything with him. Which to makes them looks very unskilled. With the exception of Larry Holmes who was old and way past it. Mike Spinks and the rest all let him do what he wanted. Scared to death of him.

So Johnson beat some unskilled guys and Tyson beat a bunch of scarredy cats and an old man is how I see it. That's why Tyson's wins don't impress me anymore than Johnson's.

 

Tyson never beat a great fighter in his life, this fight would be the same.

 

Razor Ruddock, Larry Holmes, Pinklon Thomas, Bonecrusher Smith, Trevor Berbick and the rest were all big strong capable heavyweights. Most were world champions and had long spells in the top 10. And they were all a bunch of scaredy cats? Really?

Talking of being scared, how do you think little Burns, O'Brien, Fitz, Ketchel and Langford felt when they were staring up at the Galveston Giant? Tyson wouldn't even be allowed to fight those guys.

 

It's hard to give Johnson much of a chance here. Maybe he can tie up and frustrate tyson for awhile like a Bonecrusher Smith did but I can't see him living with Mike's explosive and powerful combinations.

 

I take it you haven't actually seen many of Tyson's fights? Many of the guys he fought clearly weren't "scared" of him until after he hurt them. Did Ruddock look like a "scaredy cat"? Did Berbick? Tubbs? Bruno? Pinklon Thomas?

 

Yes Foxy, much like Donald Trump, wasn't shy about expressing an opinion, even it if is often way over the top.