If Holyfield was a few years younger against Lewis

Their is a difference between deserving the win and getting the win.

 

History says.

Flynn Ko'd Dempsey in the 1st round.

Liston was TKO'd in the first fight with Ali and KO'd in the second fight.

History also shows that the legendary Ali lost to Leon Spinks and that Lewis demolished Tyson when they fought.

Most people have the intelligence to put these outcomes in some kind of context but apparently you lack that skill.

 

The decision of Holy Lewis 1 was highly disputed. I watched it live and my jaw dropped when it was announced. Holy in both fights just could not get things going vs Lewis. He looked very unimpressive.

 

He sure seemed to get things going in the second fight.

 

What is your point? Also you didn't answer my questions. Did you not say Lewis from the first fight beats any Holyfield? Did Lewis from the first fight beat Holyfield? :think

 

Bottom line Lewis Holy 1 was and is considered a very bad decision. Most felt Lewis won. I watched the bout live and my jaw dropped when the decision was announced. Holy never looked good fighting Lewis.

 

As I said, their is a difference between deserving the decision, and actually receiving it.

 

I have just been reading through your stupid quotes, it's easy to see you aren't a fan of Lewis. Did your wife leave you for losing a big bet on him or something?

Personally, I think anything that comes out of this idiots mouth should be taken with a pinch of salt. :good

 

I would not say Lewis had a glass chin. He was indeed koed twice with for the most part singular punches. These punches however were thrown by two huge punchers on a unfocused Lewis. Lewis in rematches beat them both in one sided fashion. So YES you must knock Lewis down a few pegs for those two defeats BUT to then come back to utterly destroy both of these fighters in rematches indeed shows ATG attributes. It is these type fights historians look for to be able to rank fighters along with past ATG champions.

 

I don't hate Lewis at all. I just think he's severely overrated on this forum. I've met the man. He was a very nice guy. But I've actually seen someone on this forum try to say he had a better chin than Dempsey and Frazier. Needless to say, he got shut down very quickly.

 

I agree to some extent.

 

You're trying to have your cake and eat it too. You saying context is not relevant in determining whether Holyfield got a draw, but speculating on whether Holyfield could have beaten Lewis in another situation, which, by definition, requires context. Really epic fail there.

Holyfield made adjustments for the second fight, which Lewis, as was his nature, got a bit lazy for, thinking how easy the first fight was. Lewis still won. Holyfield really had nothing that could have ever really troubled Lewis. He was only a couple years older than Lewis, so the age thing is really overblown. He was decisively beaten by Bowe when he was younger and indisputably in prime, and Bowe had similar qualities to Lewis but is almost unanimously considered the weaker fighter. I really never saw any real argument that Holyfield ever could have beaten Lewis. Holyfield has some of the strongest fans around though, and I think its more a reflection of their hopes etc than any logical argument based on realistic evaluation of boxing.

 

Wait, you're actually saying that Frazier and Dempsey had better chins than Lewis?!

Lewis was only knocked down twice. He only lost twice, from those kd's. The first time was a bs stoppage, Dempsey would have received a ko much more justly from being KNOCKED OUT OF THE RING by Firpo than Lewis from a single kd he got up from in time from McCall. Dempsey was kd'd MANY more times than Lewis, and by MUCH lesser opp. Frazier was kd'd even more, in MANY fewer fights than Lewis. If you think Bonavena could kd Lewis, you are crazy.

 

Bonevena could bang. He certainly could stop Lewis if he hit him as did McCall etc. Frazier was hit by the hardest puncher ever in Foreman to register eight of those knockdowns. I do not believe Lewis would have gotten up as did Frazier.

Lewis was koed twice by singular punches but he avenged both via one sided kos. A huge minus but also a huge plus. Trying to compare chins is sn impossible endeavor don't you think?

 

Yes I am, and most people do to.

Dempsey was only knocked out once, when he hadn't eaten for three days.

No, no it wasn't.

Firpo hit MUCH harder than McCall. Sorry if you can't handle it.

Please don't tell me Lewis's opponents hit harder than Dempsey's? :-( The difference between Lewis and, both Frazier and Dempsey, is that they actually got up from Knockdowns to win a fight.

You're right Frazier had a glass chin. He was knocked down six times by George Foreman, Just the hardest puncher of all time. No big deal right?

Foreman himself couldn't cold**** Frazier, but the likes of McCall and Rahman would? You really think Lewis would've survived the punishment Frazier endured in Manila? Get the **** out of here. Do you even know the definition of chin? Bonavena was a very hard puncher. Moreso than McCall and Rahman, if they can knock Lewis out, Bonavena could knock him dead. :deal

Sorry if you can't handle it.