the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.


  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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  2. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Victor Galindez W15 Yaqui Lopez I

    I like watching Yaqui Lopez. He's a hardened, grizzled, consummate pro who travelled far and wide to take on the toughest of the tough in perhaps the deepest, most talented era of light heavyweight history, and came up just a bit short in his multiple biggest moments. Sort of the Buffalo Bills of boxing.

    Here, he travels to Rome to take on the always tough champion Galindez for his WBA belt, and has it going well for himself early, scoring with that piston-like jab and keeping Galindez at bay. You can see where Rossman got the blueprint for beating Galindez later........the jab, fighting within yourself, keep the distance, spin Galindez and keep yourself in center ring, and don't give in to the urge to slug. It all works well through about six rounds, but then the champ begins to heat up.

    At first Galindez scores with little more than clubbing overhand rights to the back of the head (he does this repeatedly and frankly fights very dirty in the bout), but never draws a warning for it. Between that, the low blows, and holding and hitting, Lopez is thrown off his game and suddenly his simple jab-jab-jab-hook-jab-shuffle to the right routine doesn't seem like enough to win any rounds. Galindez is closing the distance and scoring with some legal blows too. The referee is a waste of air and does nothing, which is a shame, because Galindez only won by one point on two cards. Had he rightfully been deducted a couple points, Lopez would have taken the title home. Personally, I had it clear for Galindez, 9-6. Lopez seemed able to fight in only one speed and had no extra gear once Galindez got untracked, a sadly familiar tale for this tough, honest tradesman.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Wilfred Benitez SD15 Carlos Palomino

    Palomino would say years later that he didn't really hit Benitez properly, in this, his losing title defence against the prodigy, but he probably landed enough 3/4 punches in the fourth in order to take the round, his first. Benitez won the first three with calm concentrated boxing, grazing out that left jab, landing the occasional right hand and generally doing just enough to bank the frame. His feints (up instead of down) are nice although Palomino doesn't seem particularly impressed. I do think he was impressed by the left Palomino landed at the end of the fifth, a stinging punch that drove him back to the ropes and allowed Palomino to close; he landed two other decent lefts in the round and I think it bagged him his second consecutive on the cards.

    6-2 after eight. Palomino has become a bit reluctant because he finds himself getting hit so often when he's punching. Benitez meanwhile just keeping himself off the centre line (although he jabs from dead centre) and uses a dipping, reasonably subtle movement of the head to keep punches from properly targeting (Palomino has his successes mind) and to ready himself for sliding and riding of shots. It's not right to say Palomino is bamboozled, he's still executing a diluted version of his round one fightplan, but he just can't get any punches together.

    8-2 after ten. He can do this to guys, Benitez. He's not even really using the ring here though, he's just in front of Palomino, leading him in until he feels the angle is right then leading, before counter-punching him tot death, sometimes in the pocket.

    Stirring, though, to see Palomino try to get his foot down and rescue this fight, taking the eleventh (narrowly) and twelfth in the process. Benitez is tiring and either Palomino has recognised this or coincidently (or by educated guess) happened to make his move when Benitez didn't have the same pep for the squabble. He's still counterpunching but not so much that Palomino finds it prohibitive any more. An impressive surge. I'm not a huge fan of Benitez, but he fights a thrilling fourteenth to stop the rot. The round is nip and tuck with Palomino getting slightly the better of it when Palomino manages to pin him to the rope. Here, he sets out to abuse him, only to find himself out-punched in a toe-to-toe war with the kid, his blistering body assault evaporating on the hot stone of Benitez's counterpunching ability. He actually hast to back up and try again, at which point Benitez really let's him have it, something like uppercuts with both hands. Inspiring stuff.

    SO i have it 10-5. Zach Clayton's card for Palomino must be one of the very worst in history.

    Benitez:1,2,3,6,7,8,9,10,14,15
    Palomino:4,5,11,12,13,
     
  4. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Hey, come on, the sun was in his eyes! LOL!
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Wilfred Benitez SD10 Bruce Curry

    Benitez sure gets served notice on Curry's left hook,hit hard with it in the first 90 seconds and momentarily in trouble with the hook twice whistling over his head later in the round. Benitez gets the jab working in the next round though.

    In the third, Benitez goes a bit macho and wants to try to bang with Curry, the puncher in the fight. It goes OK, but I thought he lost the round, barely, it was an interesting experiment and he should have shelved it there. In the fourth, though, he fights even more aggressively, attacking Curry and heaving huge right hands across, sometimes landing sometimes missing, while relying upon that radar to keep him out of trouble. As always, this strategy works - until it doesn't. While he's dishing out two-handed punishment, Curry drops him very heavily with a picture perfect thugish left hook. Benitez is in bad trouble in trying to get up and falls again. I think if it was fought in 2015, this would have been Benitez derailed - as it is he gets to continue and gets dropped heavily again, as he is unable to defend himself. When he gets up but falls through the ropes and hits his head on the canvas, the fight should have been stopped but Arthur Mecante - who rates this one of the best fights he ever was in - allows it to continue.

    Benitez is dropped again in the opening seconds of the fifth. He is still not able to defend himself. Again, I think it should be stopped. He is also, surely, 4-1 down on any sensible card. The rest of the fifth is just utterly bizarre; Curry is punched out, Benitez doesn't have his legs under him but engages the radar and uses the upper body to elude his man.

    Six was also absurd. Benitez actually doesn't have his legs under him, at all, but he's so brilliant at evading that Curry is just missing and missing and missing and missing. And at the end of the round, Benitez scores with a few punches. I scored it even. But Benitez is back in round seven and I thought he took it with clipping punches off the ropes.

    I have them 4-4-1 going into the tenth and Benitez just outworking Curry in that ragged, desperate round. Not a great fight by my eye but an absorbing, interesting one and a wonderful comeback from Benitez. Decision could have gone any one of three ways because it was scored on rounds, but there was never a better advert for the 10 points must by which Curry would have won huge.

    Benitez:2,7,8,9,10
    Curry:1,3,4,5,
    Even:6,
     
  6. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    If you had given Curry the 6th round you would have been able to employ the supplemental point system NY allowed. It was used in the event of an even score and you would have been able to add points onto Curry's score for the 4th and 5th round. It is a little bizarre when you think about it. Not being able to utilize it until your score is even. The 10 point must system would have paid Curry dividends.
     
  7. Drew101

    Drew101 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Lupe Pintor MD15 Alberto Davila

    Davila had defeated Pintor over ten several years earlier, and it's easy to see why as soon as this fight begins. Davila is a bit faster of hand and foot, and while he's not nearly as strong and doesn't hit as hard, he's the sharper puncher and they catch your attention more than Pintor's.

    Davila bags the first three rounds on my card, punctuating the early dominance with a sweet right hands than staggers Pintor pretty dramatically. It doesn't actually seem to hurt him, really...but he needed to do a serious two-step to keep from falling to the canvas. Pintor rights the ship in round four, getting the jab on track and landing to the body with a bit more frequency. Davila responds by clearly taking the fifth on my card, and the sixth as well. Pintor's had a few moments, but is down 5-1 on my card at this point.

    But in rounds seven and eight, Pintor starts to come on. He's still landing downstairs, but is starting to do some really good business with the right hand upstairs. Davila's still firing, but isn't landing with nearly the same amount of venom and is having a harder time keeping Pintor at bay. The trend continues in the ninth and tenth and we are now even going into the championship rounds on my card.

    Davila seems to realize that he needs to do something dramatic and spends rounds eleven and twelve standing in ring centre, trading with Pintor in some really violent exchanges. 11th, 12th and 13th are all pretty ferocious; Davila tries to out-punch and outland the champ to the head, but Pintor manages to walk through the incoming and does enough to win one of the three rounds (11th) and earn a split of the next stanza. But Pintor marches forward and Davila seems to have wilted by the 13th.

    14th round is all Pintor, and he hands Davila a serious hiding in the round. The effort of ass-kicking Alberto seems to have taken a bit of a toll on Lupe, and the 15th is quieter, though Pintor still seems very much in control of things to me.

    So, 8-6-1 Pintor in my card (144-142).

    Hell of a fight. I don't know if I'd refer to it as being an all time classic, but I wouldn't argue with anyone who did.
     
  8. Drew101

    Drew101 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Leonard Dorin SD12 Raul Horatio Balbi

    This is a classic.

    Dorin takes the first, marching forward and then firing volleys of punches downstairs and landing some nice chopping right hands to the head. Balbi stays in front of his foe, firing one twos at the gloves to set up his own hook to the liver. Very good first round, and an initally apathetic crowd seems to like it.

    Then the second round begins. Balbi lands a really evil left hook that seems to hurt Dorin pretty badly, and he laces him with some hand combos for a little while after. Undaunted, Dorin responds by storming forward and firing away with both hands, initiating insane exchanges that are drawing some audible "oohs" from a suddenly interested crowd. Balbi continues to land some really hard counters and is beginning to bust up Dorin, but is getting swamped by his opponent's non-stop attack. Crowd now loves this fight as the bell rings, giving these two a standing O.

    More toe-to-toe exchanging in the third and fourth, with Dorin landing more, but Balbi landing harder and flashier stuff. Dorin's now cut over one eye and swelling around the other. Fourth features Dorin landing a wicked hook at the beginning of the round, only to swallow a brutal uppercut near the end that buckles his knees. Madness through four, and I've got it 3-1 Balbi.

    He looks ghastly, but still continues to fight. The action doesn't necessarily slow down in the fifth, but becomes kind of hypnotic. Lots of really hard exchanges, but Dorin seems to take the round pretty clearly, landing more and preventing Balbi from landing anything really spectacular in return. Both rounds are close, but I've got Dorin winning 'em to even the fight up on my card.

    Dorin ramps up the pressure in round seven, and has Balbi looking like he's on the verge of wilting at the bell after lacing him with some hard right hands. Lederman gave it to Balbi, along with the previous two...But there's no god damned way he came close to taking this stanza. Balbi does take the eighth though, landing quadruple hooks downstairs and lacing Balbi with the hook up top. Balbi's now cut over both eyes and is an absolute mess.

    But, the effort of really dominating the 8th seems to have taken something out of the Argentinian, and Dorin spams the right hand in the 9th, and has Raul looking disorganized at the bell. Dorin gets docked a point in the 10th for a low blow for a not particularly serious low blow (though he had been warned before). Incensed, Dorin plows forward and rakes Balbi with punches, both hands churning into his opponent's body and head; Balbi fires back with venom and the two exhange to the bell.

    Eleventh round is a little bit sloppy, and that favors Dorin who doesn't need to rely so much on snap to be effective, Still a fine round, though, with both guys landing their share. Final round features Dorin landing a beautiful right to start, eating a wicked uppercut in the final minute, only to continue to advance as the bell rings.

    115-112 Dorin on my card, though I don't think a card that favoured Balbi would be out of the question.

    Great, great, great fight, though. If you haven't seen it, do so. If you have...see it again. It's still worth the time.
     
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Marlon Starling UD12 Kevin Howard

    Howard outboxes Starling for most of the first round before getting caught with a pair of uppercuts and then a two scorching left hooks that drop him and hurt him. Probably saved by the bell, his box and move fight plan is in apparent ruins although he runs well enough in two, clears his head. It's clear enough for him to return to stick and move and pick up the third. Starling does a better job tracking him down in the fourth but Howard has his successes too. Starling looks a little less busy than he should, even when Howard stops to rest.

    I have it 5-1 after six and it's starting to get that one-sided feel. It's not exactly boring, there are too many excellent exchanges for that to be true, but Starling comes off better in every single one of them, almost, and Howard isn't having much success keeping him off any more.

    It's confusing, really, that Starling can't get him out of there. It's like he's worried about his engine or something. It's not good. He's pummelling Howard, with good uppercuts and pressure but he doesn't sustain it. Howard's bravery is somehow starting to outweight Starling's total dominance in my mind. Starling's high, mobile guard, was nice though, he picked a lot of punches.

    Starling:1,2,4,5,6,7,8,10,11,12.
    Howard:3,9.
     
  10. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Need to re watch the Lewis v Holy series.

    Maybe the two most multi dimensional HW fighters in history, is that fair to say? Never saw either fight as close but I like to review these things every now and again and see if there's at least an argument for Holy in the second fight.

    Finding the time is difficult though.
     
  11. KO KIDD

    KO KIDD Loyal Member Full Member

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    Danny Garcia vs Lucas Matthysse 12 Rounds 140 lb Title
    I remember watching this live on PPV and thinking this was a very close fight with Lucas pushing the pace and I had the fight very close but to my surprise the SHO guys and a lot of posters on here had the perception that this wasn’t close at all. I scored it live and never revisited as it never really got uploaded in full. I found another inside the arena vid to watch and score. No commentary to sway but again like a judge I’m only getting one angle

    Round 1: Very tactical round fought at long range. LM attempted to cut the gap and DG would do subtle steps just to get out of range without burning much energy. They exchanged jabs here and there with DG trying a few at the body. One decent exchange by the ropes where each guy seemed to land an ineffectual right hand. DG did land what appeared to be a good left hook counter. Very tough round to score. 10-9 Garcia

    Round 2: This was as clear as it gets for LM. He did one thing exceptionally well in this round and that is duck the left hook. He ducked a left hook early in the round and landed a left hook that sent DG to the ropes. DG clinched with what looked like a wrestling front headlock and would not let go until Weeks said stop and still he had to be pried loose by the referee. LM ducked another left hook and landed a solid right hand and had a strong series with DG on the ropes. LM did a good job picking off DGs jab in his gloves. He definitely landed the hardest shot of the round and I think he was hurt by that one if only for a moment. 10-9 LM 19-19 even

    Round 3:Very competitive round which started with LM landing a solid left hook that left both tangled in the ropes. Then DG landed his first really good counter left hand of the fight and later a counter right hook something we see in a lot of his fights. DG also worked in a straight right hand. Both men competed at range with good jabs with neither mans jab seeming superior. 10-9 DG 29-28 DG

    Hmmm getting interrupted will finish this later
     
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Marlon Starling SD12 Simon Brown

    This is a beautiful illustration of counter-pressure and how it should be deployed, especially the second. Starling stalks aggressively but doesn't lead but he's so forwards, so in the kill-zone, that Brown is forced to, then Starling counter-punches with more fluid, crisper counters. The fight is caught in microcosm in the second when Brown throws a wide slapping right hand to the body and Starling counters him with a wonderful, compressed left hook to the chest. Interested to see them tested for strength early, too, it's close.

    Very close third. This is one of the most bias commentaries i've ever heard by the way. Brown is "scared", "not aggressive enough" and apparently dis-interested in what his corner are telling him. That's in addition to the normal celebrations of one punching over the other. But this is a close round with Brown moving well and finding the body often. He's still not landing most of these headshots though.

    Brown has problems. It's a case where he's fighting a guy and the rounds are close but the guy is just a little bit better. Starling has a lovely right hand. He can cuff with it, shoot with it, switch it and throw it like a jab, he uses it to pick punches off (something he can do inside, which is a wonderful skill), it's hard and sudden. Plus he can find leverage without making space for punches like Brown, who has to shift to land those hard shots to the body.

    Brown arguably wins the sixth by landing a hard punch at the opening bell, but you could easily give it the other way. It's hard to know where Brown's points are going go come from, unless the hard pace tells on Starling.

    This is one of the closest one-sided near shut-outs i've ever seen.

    The biggest difference is Starling's defence. He's disciplined with the gloves, holds them high, moves them to pick off punches, rides blows, it's a little bit on the reactive side more than the shifty side but it adds up to the same thing for Brown here who can't hit with much outside. Inside, he has success, but gets beaten up a bit.

    Both these guys have really good engines.

    Brown:6,11,12.
    Starling:1,2,3,4,5,7,8,9,10.

    How this ended up an SD i'll never ever know.
     
  13. zadfrak

    zadfrak Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Starling was never the promoter's favorite guy. If he was & they had a more vested interest, I think the scoring is different. He just rarely got the benefit of the doubt. But that Starling could read what the other guy was going to do. Always. And he sure did read Simon.

    That Brown was a good solid fighter when he was on his run. Not an easy night's work for anyone. He's just not going to have his arm raised fighting the absolute best very often. Hang tough though.
     
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Marlon Starling TKO 11 Mark Breland

    Big big height differene here. But then height never bothered Starling. His best filmed performance might even be Nunn! Here he starts off busy bodily without throwing much, feinting a bit trying to judge the range maybe. Kinda wrestles his man down. Lots of clinching when he closes, not sure who the perpetrator is.

    Based on the opener, Starling is just going to lunge, throw, buck, wrestle, wing a right hand over the top, jab when he can see it and generally be difficult. Jabbing and clinching. It's a messy fight, full of energy though and I think not bad so far, i'm enjoying it. I haven't enjoyed my review of Starling all that much for some reason. Breland wants to jab, see if he can find room for the right, but he's getting out hit I think. Still, his right looks hard and he might be able to mess up the rounds. Finally Starling hooks to the body. He's got a lot going on, Starling, there's a lot he can do.

    But it's BReland that takes the second, he looks a lot less ostrich and he throws some nice punches, the uppercut he finishes up his final one with in the second round is magic. Starling throws him down again at the beggining of the third. Very accurate with that winging right. Breland is throwing very hard punches but Starling picks a few of them very nicely, it was a real surge of punches and Starling got about two thirds of them I think, though he was bashed to the body. Very good round of boxing. Very good.

    On his way to losing the round, Starling lands a sizzling punch to the left ear of Breland that rattles him. Sharpshooting at its best. I think it nicks him an excellent round. The fourth is excellent too, Breland taking it with bread and butter double-jabs and the one-two, mixed with the occasional bodyshot to keep his man guessing. Starling is very strong though - he looks untroubled and throws Breland down again. If he does that again it'll be a point I think. That one was maybe six and two-threes.

    Last warning for Starling as Breland is wrestled to the ground again in the opening of the fifth; I think Breland hit the deck on purpose in the sixth and succeeds in having a point taken form Starling. Allowign that Breland probably won the fifth with hard work up close and sharp punching outside and the sixth with the cleaner work it gives Breland a prohibitive lead 4-2 with one point off. All this pulling and pushing is ruining it a bit. Breland is throwing himself to the ground on purpose I think. He's down again. Breland has the jab working though. In combination with his falling over when he feels like he's in trouble/it might be a point he has a prohibitive lead - Starling needs a knockout...

    Breland is tired in the eighth and Starling is coming on, not particularly affective but directly and aggressively. Breland is flopping about like Bambi but lands a great right hand sort of in desperation as he gives ground in the ninth. Breland doesn't have the legs for running any more, so they exchange on the ropes. This favours Starling but Breland is fighting hard.

    Without his legs under him, Breland is going to get caught at some point and he is, by a rampant Starling who had plenty left with which to pulverise Breland once he's hurt him. Breland is knocked out. Bodypunches sent him running, right hands hurt him in the onslaught against the ropes and he finished him with a left. Pretty demonstrative of Starling's varied skills.

    I had this fight closer than the judges at the time of the stoppage - the first and third are the rounds he did not get from the commentary team who also favoured Breland.

    STARLING:1,3,9,10,
    BRELAND:2,4,5,6*,7,8,
     
  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Marlon Starling TKO9 Lloyd Honeyghan

    Honeyghan was probably slightly past it here and was in fact in the ring with an illegal pain-killer coursing through his veins courtesy of his bad hands. This is Starling entering his absolute prime. He's got Futch in his corner, he's got that absolute self-assurance is thirty years old and he's a fifty-fight veteran; he has learned his craft.

    These two hated each other. One observer stated that Honeyghan was the type of fighter that would try to smuggle a blade into the ring if he could have got away with it and I suspect Starling is the fighter he would most liked to have cut.

    Very early, Starling waits on his man, lands a single beautiful counter-punch and tries to nullify the lively stuff that is coming back. Then he gets busy. He lets Honeyghan work but whenever he decides to contest the fight, he wins those exchanges.

    I love Starling's variety. Here, faced with an aggressive, dominating opponent he elects to counter-punch early while keeping pressure on. Honeyghan is doing ok in terms of workrate but - he's not landing a lot of shots, not even to the body where Starling's defence sometimes is less comprehensive. I think i'd argue Honeyghan for the second though, based upon workrate and a nice right-uppercut. Very close though. Honeyghan wants to be as close as possible but Starling is adept at making room with a step and counter-punching. He is outworked through the first 90 seconds of 2 though. I have him taking the third also, but in in the fourth, after waiting through two minutes of messy dominacne by Honeyghan, Starling lands as many as nine hard counters in the final minute, uppercuts and hooks mainly, enough to poach a fascinating round. Honeyghan is working very very hard. Starling opened the excellent fifth aggressively looking for left hooks to the body, Starling knocks out his mouth-piece and lands hard punches near the bell to take the round. Honeyghan looks a little uncertain for the first time. Sick three-piece to knock the gumshield out. Honeyghan goes on the run in the sixth, and it's Starling calmly following. It makes for much less entertaining boxing in an even round which i'll give to Starling on margins in defence and generalship and a sizzling right hand which blasts Honeyghan's gumshield into the crowd in the final thirty seconds. Honeyghan absolutely needs to win the seventh.

    He don't. In the eighth, Honeyghan gets beaten up, his eyes are closing. The swelling that has developed to his jaw bring the doc to the ring between rounds. The writing's on the wall, but he's a determined man and Starling still has to do the job. Honeyghan helps him by sort of collapsing in terms of resistance and to the canvas; he's just had enough i think and would like someone to rescue him. Mills Lane obliges. Good refereeing I think.


    STARLING:1,4,5,6,7,8,
    HONEYGHAN:2,3,