Carlos Monzon vs Sugar Ray Leonard

The difference, or course, is that Forrest was also quick. There was no huge advantage in speed. Leonard was eons quicker than Monzon and he was a far greater technical fighter. The only advantage Monzon would have is strength and right hand punching power. Leonard outboxes Monzon to take the U decision win. And before anyone calls me a "fanboy" I cheered against SRL during every single one of his amateur and pro bouts.

 

Although Sugar Ray Leonard found a way to win during his prime, I would pick Carlos Monzon over him because Monzon had a big advantage in size and strength in addition to knowing what he was doing. But Leonard would still have a very good chance due to his boxing skills, heart and quickness.

- Chuck Johnston

 

who you cheered for makes no difference. Ray ain't beating Monzon. He was too chicken to make a defense (but he wasn't too chicken to pick a fight with Lalonde)

 

Silly.....SRL had the skills to potentially beat any fighter at welter/middleweight. A great and outstanding talent. You can make the case Monzon was a bigger/stronger middleweight and punched harder but Ray was far more skilled in just about every category. And that skill level was ATG class.

 

I don't have an opinion on this one (haven't seen enough Monzon) but I have a question: which of Monzon's performances suggest that he would be able to deal with Leonard's lateral movement and in-and-out attacks?

 

None of them.

 

Yes, Rodrigo Valdez. That murderous puncher. :roll:

His track record of knocking out top fighters is legendary. He was always knocking out all-timers at middleweight. The hall of famers alone he stopped are amazing.

Let's see, there was ... um. And, um ...

Oh wait ...

That's right.

 

Yes, Leonard lost but few could have doubted his mettle eschewing natural advantages of speed and mobility to hang tough with Duran. Or maybe he was forced to fight like that. Either way he stood toe to toe and he took his lumps and tried to turn it around.

Marvin's performance against Duran was widely held to be rather uncharacteristically timid and showing too much respect. That's not revisionism. It's just saying how it was. The W or the L aren't the point here.

 

Exactly.

Although I don't consider Sergio Martinez nearly as good as Leonard, not by a longshot, and Martinez was a southpaw and all that ... and Kelly Pavlik probably wasn't as good as Monzon, although he may have had a similar reign as Monzon if he got to fight Monzon's opposition ...

Given the many differences ... I could easily see Leonard-Monzon playing out like Martinez-Pavlik. With the slightly smaller guy using side-to-side movement and in-and-out punching against the limited, straight-up guy throwing one-twos and not moving his head much.

Over 15 rounds, a prime Leonard either befuddles and stops Monzon late or wins a clear decision.

 

what does monzon do that's better than ray leonard. all i see is a bunch of nostalgic bullsh**. monzon has losses and draws against guys who nobody bothered to even make wikipedia pages for. his style is more crude than technical, and he's robotic.. he has no fluidity in his movement, and his punches were very wide. monzon is overrated. leonard by UD

 

who did Leonard ever stop at middleweight? And Valdez was a hard puncher. The idea that a fighter has to knock out hall of famers to be considered a hall of famer is completely false. The fact that you think a middleweight champion who was never close to being stopped in his career would be stopped against a fighters who has no knockouts of substance as a middleweight is laughable.

Keep laughing. You are repeatedly showing you have zero understanding of the sport. Monzon dominates Leonard.

 

as a body puncher, I would agree but this potential (to beat any welter/middle) you're talking about is an empty claim you don't have the burden of ever having to prove. You can't

the reason he chose Duran over Nunn as an opponent is the same reason he chose never to fight a prime Hagler; he knew he'd lose and lose badly

the only middleweights he faced were a used up Hagler (a four round fighter still hanging on to his WBC title) and Geraldo, an arm puncher who had Ray doing the zab Judah dance before it's time

Ray is just too small, and judging by his terrible loss to Terry Norris, if he doesnt have just the right opponent at the right time (a safe opponent like Kevin Howard),, he tends to get spanked badly in those fights

his overall record 36-3-3 What, that's all? vs monzon's maginficent record. Leonard loses

 

I thought Leonard showed lots of heart vs an ancient Camacho, especially in the fifth

in the fight before that vs Norris, I was completely overawed by his courage in round ten. Even though near tears, Ray never gave up!

and he only lost 8 of the rounds by two points

Leonard is just too much of a loser/ducker to be competing in the same ring as the magnificent Monzon

 

is leonard considered to be an all-time great middleweight? top-ten maybe?

 

too small, no defenses, and outpointed a dilapidated Hagler the way Leon Spinks beat a dilapidated Ali

Just remember the redrooster rule: Leonard excels against stiff, slowfooted, slowfisted relics (Hagler, Duran) but look at the results vs trigger fisted, feetfooted boxers with movement (Norris) and it turns into a one sided blowout

Check it out and you'll see the wisdom in my words

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