Érik Morales vs. Juan Manuel Márquez

Shame this never came to fruition to close the loop of the era's "Little Big 4", along with MAB & Pac-Man.

Two accurate, crisp-punching stylists with skill, timing, and speed and, while not coma-inducing power, enough to get & keep the respect of all-time greats and to each stop roughly ⅗ of their opponents, both with more than sixty professional bouts on their dossier. This may, in a sadly ironic twist, have been the most fan-friendly possible h2h match-up to be made betwixt the foursome, as well as the one that "got away".

To make it easier, I have broken it down into epochal categories rather than say "this or that version of either (ie, Morales vs. blank or Márquez on such-and-such night...)".

They both debuted in 1993 and fought until 2012 and 2014 respectively (Dinamita breaching the ropes just twice El Terrible last saw combat, although Morales wouldn't happen to officially retire until a month after Márquez's standing final triumph over Alvarado) - so we have nineteen years of potential overlap, though both weren't always campaigning in the same division at the same time. I'll restrict our categories to when they were, and thus could have fought each other...excluding moves up or down in weight, or catchweights.

Márquez debuted at 122 but soon entrenched himself at FW where he more or less remained until 2006. Morales did the opposite, starting at feather and then cutting to bantam, graduating to super bantam in mid-94 and camping out there until the millennium turned.

So let's burn-card those first seven years, as if they were penance for breaking a mirror, and concentrate on the dozen years they were both active in this century.

Márquez wasn't going to make 122lbs in 2000, so that's out. Morales, however, jumped after Barrera I and never returned to SBW. For a three year period from 2000 until 2003, this was a viable match-up at featherweight. So let's start there.

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  Márquez spent his time licking the wounds (mostly to his pride) from the loss to Freddie Norwood and venting his frustrations on a litany of fringe contender, stopping most of them as he went 13-0 (11) en route to an IBF world title eliminator and eventual title capture and then unification with the WBA. Morales took a much shorter path to his championship, blasting through Mike Juarez in a tuneup before snatching the green belt from Kelley and making a couple of very respectable defenses before losing his prize in the Barrera rematch. It didn't change hands, though, as Barrera didn't feel like forking over his lunch money to Sulaiman - which made the belt available for Érik to immediately reclaim and squeak in a couple more defenses (including a rematch with Gainer, a foe vanquished in his first reign) before feeling the brunt of making the weight and deciding it was time for a change. Both were in top form during this period, and one could argue in their peak & prime condition physically.

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  from 2004 until 2006, @ 130lbs. 'But wait', you say - Márquez spent all of that lingering down at 126lbs, so how was that viable? Well, because he only stayed there due to extremely lucrative opportunities falling in his lap. Pacquiao I represented a then unprecedentedly handsome reward of half a million dollars. Negotiations for an immediate rematch dragged on for the remainder of the year, with Murad "I made all the mistakes to pave the way for Al Haymon to learn what pitfalls to avoid" Muhammad niggling over contractual details until he ran the showdown into the dirt (at least until 2008, when he was no longer in the picture). In the meantime, significantly lesser paydays were Márquez's way of biding time until he could, hopefully, crack a million in another dance with Manny. In contrast, he only made $32k in his loss to Chris John. He probably wishes in hindsight that he could've smelled the rot in the air with Muhammad, given up on the rematch and moved up to super feather earlier than he did - not because he ever had trouble making 126 (he didn't) but simply due to all the glittering marquee names - Pacquiao, Morales, and Barrera - having already coalesced into a giant cash-printing machine at 130lbs. In this span you have the aforementioned Pac I draw and John loss, both controversial - as well as several other fine performances highlighted by dominant victories over the likes of Salido & Jandaeng. Meanwhile, the sharp-jawed kid from Tijuana was busy cementing his legacy with a brilliant if brief title reign (dethroning Jesús Chávez - and doing arguably better than Floyd Mayweather Jr. did against him, aside from the end result - and thwarting a challenge by Famoso Hernández) followed by yet another instant-legend war in the MAB rubber match, and the crowning achievement of Morales' career - his own first match with Pacquiao. Of course, things quickly spiraled into a bad place for Morales on the back-end of this period, suffering three consecutive defeats. Each was more ignominious than its predecessor. He wasn't supposed to lose to Zahir Raheem, a slick natural lightweight but not considered particularly special, evinced by having lost close but clear to Rocky Juarez. Lose he did, however - and he lost badly, with Raheem installed as 25/1 underdog, actually schooling him. Things got worse in the return engagement with Pacquiao, who laid a banana peel on the welcome mat for Morales' homecoming to 130lbs and dealt the proud iron-chinned warrior the first stoppage defeat of his career. The dark times hit a critical mass ten months later, when Morales failed to even make it competitive in the rubber match and was reduced to quitting on the canvas, lasting under nine minutes under Pac's onslaught before willingly riding out the count of Vik Drakulich with a poignantly apologetic shake of the head directed towards his father in the corner, signaling what appeared to be the absolute end of Morales in boxing. He of course would rage against the dying of a light and incurred a fourth loss to Díaz in another stab at lightweight in 2007, and promptly announced his retirement. So in the interests of keeping things sporting, let's chop this period in half and demarcate from 2004 until mid-2005, when both were still firing on all cylinders and Márquez already had an eye on super featherweight anyway (with his ascent delayed only by Murad's carrot-dangling shenanigans).

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  2010 until 2012, @140lbs. Morales, unable to resist the lure of the gladiatorial arena, succumbed to its siren call within three years and shook off some rust at the expense of some mid-grade talents. He looked unspectacular in these outings, but his determination and class were enough to see him through and land him the first major clash of his comeback: Marcos Rene Maidana...with a vacant interim world title sweetening the pot. In what everyone had expected to be a case of the hungry young lion devouring the old, Morales turned back the clock and forced El Chino to go life & death, only narrowly falling short via majority decision. After this he looked terrific popping the cherry of an even younger up-and-comer in Demoledor Cano. This vaulted him up the WBC rankings and bought him passage to another immediate world title shot and chance at redemption, with the effective but flawed Danny Garcia. Morales bottled some of that same lightning he used on Maidana, and once more was surprisingly game in a tough contest that didn't go his way. His second lease on life expired sometime between March and October, however, as Garcia easily disposed of him in the rematch, landing nearly as many power shots as Morales even threw and knocking him out in 4. Márquez rang in the new decade with a couple of top-notch clinics of counter-punching at lightweight in Juan Díaz II and Katsidis, reestablishing himself after the ill-advised and bulk-laden jump up to welterweight challenge Mayweather in 2009. Now pushing forty, and with the rigors of having gone through such a bulking up process, Márquez abandoned his success at 135 just when on the cusp (a fight or two away) of being viewed as the undisputed "man" of the division - and sought greener pastures at light welter. He blew out Likar Ramos and was lured up once more to welter (or rather, a 144lb catchweight) for another chance to finally overcome his nemesis, Manny Pacquiao. This would be yet another bitter pill to swallow on the official judges' scorecards, but Márquez brushed himself off and, undeterred, promptly snatched up the WBO title at light welter by chasing a terrified Sergei Fedchenko around the ring all night and chiseling away on him every time he left an opening. Finally, just a few weeks after Morales' dreams were permanently shelved in Garcia II, he got his revenge at last with the epic KO6 icing of Pacquiao...contracted at the full welter limit with no CW, but with Márquez coming in at 143, nearer 140 than 147. So this entire span was viable for both Mexicans to meet at light welter, had there been any inclination on the part of either man's handlers.

I welcome everyone to vote on all four epochs, and give a rundown of how you seen each version of the fight playing out. :good

 

:readthre:, bunghole.

 

Very interesting, Hans. So in your view the epoch in question really does matter.

 

Let's hear some fight breakdowns. What can E1 Márquez and Morales do to each other that later versions can't? Et cetera.

 

This is what I was looking for.

 

...though I disagree on E3. I think JMM of the Pac III/Fedchenko/Pac IV run is too good for comeback Morales, and would have rather easily beaten the Maidana and Garcia to whom Érik dropped close decisions.

 

Rummy, you've gone El Terrible all the way? :think


edit: just saw your post. :good