Hello, Burns of the Gunner Moir fight vs the Frank Moran who fought Johnson. 20 rounds who wins? Thank You.
I believe that Moran would have won. Many people thought that Moran should have gotten a draw against Johnson.
Moran was far more competitive vs Johnson, and on the 20+ minutes of footage I own that includes several rounds show. It's a very close fight based on the footage. Moran was a real heavyweight, over 6 feet tall, and 200+ pounds. A stark contrast from the 5'7" 168 pound Tommy Bruns he pretty much man handled and a 5'9" Ketchel. So Johnson could not clinch and maul him easily. Johnson was also 36 for the match. This would be a close match up as Burns was the most skilled of the two. I'd side with Burns in a competitive fight. Moran just has too many decision losses on his resume. And many of them were at the hands of lesser men than Burns.
Johnson vs Moran was a close fight? What limits will you go to diss Johnson? Why lie???? Le Cri de Paris: "Johnson had a cakewalk with a fighter he probably could have rid himself of in a few minutes." This paper alleged that Johnson carried Moran because he was an owner of 2/3 of the motion picture revenue and hoped to make money by making the film longer and making Moran look good for white audiences. Le Journal: "The Negro champion of the world dominated his challenger for twenty rounds." and "Almost from the beginning of the contest it seemed as if the fight would not last ten rounds. This was a mistake because Johnson never pressed his attack and the contest lasted the limit." Le Matin: "Jack Johnson smiled throughout the contest, smiled openly, smiled at his seconds, and laughed at Frank Moran whenever Moran would hit him in the stomach. The public was disgusted with his exhibition." The paper compared Moran to a school boy playing the role of a general who is then confronted with having to fill the generals shoes and is ill prepared for the task at hand. It intimated that while Moran was brave he appeared to lose confidence the instant Johnson entered the ring. Le Petit Parisien: "He (Johnson) beat Moran on points easily." L'Humanite: "By the third round Johnson had asserted his superiority over Moran." "The match was disappointing, one is left with the impression that Moran is not in Johnson's class." "Johnson clearly won on points but he is no longer the Johnson of old." Le Figaro: This paper also said Johnson had the fight firmly in his grasp by the third round despite it being a dull monotonous affair. "Moran did not understand that at 27 years old he must take the fight to the 36 year old Johnson." By the tenth round Johnson was in such control that the author expected him to land a knockout blow at any moment. "Defeat (for Moran) was a certainty." The paper stated that Johnson was "infinitely better than Moran" and his smiling and mocking of an opponent so inferior was beneath him. La Sport Universel Illustre: "Frank Moran, despite all of his inferiority, despite his poor quality, will now be able to avail himself of the privilege of having gone twenty rounds with Jack Johnson." "It was twenty rounds of monotony which ended in Johnson winning his victory without having to utilize his scientific knowledge of boxing." Most accounts mention Moran bleeding constantly throughout from his nose and that a cut above his eye affected his vision.
Perry, Rounds , 1, 5, 8, 10, 11, 13, 14, 19 and 20 shown. There is longer footage. Judge for yourself on the show rounds. Many of the rounds were close. It should be noted that Johnson fought dirty, and Moran didn't receive a dime for this fight. One foul, hitting on the break can be seen in round 14. June 27, 1914 – Jack Johnson W 20 Frank Moran, Paris. The night of the fight arrived, Frank Moran versus Heavyweight champion Jack Johnson for the heavyweight crown. George Carpentier, a young promising French light heavyweight, would referee and judge the 20-round scheduled bout. The bout would be quite a rough and tumble, bloody affair with a lot of pushing, shoving, clinching, and fouling. On several occasions Johnson was warned for throwing low blows and heel punches. Despite his best efforts, Frank was unable to unleash and connect with the spry old Johnson. As the bell sounded at the completion of the twentieth and final round the two boxers slowly walked back to their corners battered, bruised, and exhausted. Carpentier walked to the middle of the ring, stepped up to the microphone and awarded the fight to the reigning champion, Jack Johnson. A chorus of boos echoed through the arena as many of Frank’s countrymen were in attendance and felt that Frank had won the fight. After the decision was announced the two fighters embraced and Frank congratulated Johnson on retaining his title. As luck would have it, neither Frank nor Johnson would be paid for their hard fought battle as a Chicago Brewer had secured a creditor’s attachment on the purse as Johnson supposedly owed them a large sum of money. As luck would further have it, the following day after the fight, a young Bosnian-Serb would assassinate Archduke Franz-Ferdinand of Austria triggering a series of events that would begin the great war, World War I. The French government placed a moratorium on all civil debts and the promoter took full advantage of this with neither Frank nor Johnson ever receiving a cent. [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSFnFS1snmk[/url]
I see a one sided fight. Moran had trouble landing anything on Johnson to a point where when he actually did Johnson clapped his gloves together in mockery.
Nothing you posted changes the known history of the fight. Morans friends jeering the decision is fully expected. Why do you hate Johnson so? Such a great fighter admired by even the man YOU admire and Johnson koed.......Jeffries.
Well the surviving footage doesn't tell such a tale, and neither do detailed fight reports. I think Johnson edged it, and also think Moran was just a better than average " white hope type." who would not be in the top 10 today. Clearly Willard made Moran look worse. The clapping incident was just Johnson being Johnson, but I see you aren't commenting on the 20 minutes show or the fouls. It would be better for a balanced approach, no? By the way the French press reported Langford floored Johnson. Are you buying that too? The same people want to strip Jack Johnson of his title, from poor performances, and not fighting Langford and possibly Jeannette.
You have a huge issue with Jack Johnson. Very odd. The French press were at that fight. They were not at Johnsons bout with Langford. I've watched the available footage since the 70s. I see a one sided bout. Moran loading up with his right hand but rarely landing. Johnson cutting him to pieces.
Moran the day after the fight "I figured I would whip Johnson in view of his age but now I believe him to be as strong as he ever was".
The Washington herald described the fight round by round. They did not score every round but they did score the first 13 rounds. 12-0-1 at that time for Johnson. They scored two others... Both for Johnson. 14-0-1 Johnson. Reading the descriptions of the rounds NOT scored for either man there is no indication whatsoever Moran won many if any of those rounds.
