Why is Willie Pepp's win over Sandy Sadler more talked about than the 3 times Sandler

Excuses coming now.

 

Because of the crash he is seen to be a reduced version of his former prime self.

Saddler was a monster. Maybe the hardest hitting feather in history.

For a past prime light hitting defensive wizard to be able to comprehensively outpoint a prime monster, it's an amazing feat.

Would Saddler have always had his number? Who knows.

 

it's probably the highest rated performance of the 4 fights, by a guy who was up against a horrible style matchup and who'd been in a plane crash. I don't think it gets talked about more anyway tbh, unless you use the logic that saddler won 3/4 so should get 3 times the discussion of pep's win.

 

Senya, you are OBSESSED. And wrongfully so. In all the years I am on ESB, I have never read a thread making an excuse for Willie Pep losing to Sandy Saddler, other than the fact that in 1947 Pep was in that near fatal plane crash that killed most in his plane and left the critically injured Pep fighting for his life. He through sheer luck pulled through and in traction for almost 6 months, walked again and somehow fought again...I remember the boxing fraternity were astounded by Pep's return to the ring as I was too. If you in your holiness think that mention of this amazing and painful recovery is considered an EXCUSE,
well that is your problem...Whether or not Pep if not for this horrible plane crash, lost some of his amazing quickness, we will never know but
the prevailing opinion in those days was "yes he did " whether you like it or not. ciao...

 

Because more fight fans value performances that are aesthetically pleasing over the uglier, more rugged styles. It's also a primary reason why film misleads educated fight fans into picking the wrong man to win so frequently.

That is true across racial lines and across time lines, and is the primary reason. There's secondary ones, as well. Pep also had the better career outside of that rivalry, so that also doesn't help Saddler's case.

To use a contemporary example, Gene Fullmer had a winning record against Sugar Ray Robinson, too- but it's the KO for Sugar that gets the play. Get a legendary enough reputation, and you'll get passes the less accomplished and/or more crude fighter won't, even if they beat you. For a long time, Frazier was still rated as being greater than Foreman. He still is by some. Had there been a trilogy and Joe had won any of them, you'd see the same phenomenon play out 100 times worse.

 

:good

That sums it up!

 

It was the best fight of the series in terms of drama and aesthetic value. Pep got mauled in the first fight and the final two were ugly wrestling matches where Pep surrendered. It's only natural to focus one's attention on the best and most competitive fight of a series.

 

Tunney was not the greatest hwt but it's greatest BOXER.

 

Not meant to be contentious in any way, but how do you reconcile LaMotta's numerous victories where he had a weight advantage? He often came in over the middle limit against welters who were moving up and coming in weighing in the mid-150s.

How much should that be considered (or weighed might be the better word) in assessing Jake?

 

S, I don't see any correlation to this Pep/Saddler thread, but you must remember Jake LaMotta STARTED his boxing career as a light heavyweight and always had trouble making 160 pounds. I saw LaMotta twice ringside and he was a bull with the great ability to absorb
punishment. In fact his equally tough friend Rocky Graziano named him
"hammerhead"...No middleweight ever could take the vicious bombardment Ray Robinson inflicted on the weight drained LaMotta
and still remained on his feet...NONE...A great MW was Jake but H2H I could pick many many 160 pounders who would have decisioned LaMotta...

 

Both counts.

 

I have always wondered about that myself. At no point in the footage of fights 3 and 4 did it look to me the injuries were significantly impairing him. You can't evaluate shoulder pain, but the eye injury didn't look that severe from what I could see. Then you throw in that Lulu fight...makes you wonder...
I actually met Pep around 96 and spoke to him for an hour over breakfast, and I wish I knew then what I know now so I could ask informed questions.

 

Its more talked about because Pep is a more admired fighter. First of all he was up against significant physical disadvantages, the david and goliath factor being a powerful image for boxing fans. Secondly Pep was seen as a smooth stylist admired for his virtuoso ability whereas Saddler was seen as a dirty fighter willing to take unfair advantage. Finally, overall, i think most people view Pep as the better fighter. An assessment I agree with.

As for Senyas points, bogus. He makes hay of Saddler beating 3 lw champions but neglects to mention Brown was ten yrs away from winning the title and 27 bouts into a 180 bout career. He is also the same lw champion that just a month or so ago Senya was taking credit away from by saying he beat soft opposition. So if he was never that good at his best how good was saddlers win over him when he was still developing? Salas was one of the weakest lw champions ever. He held the title for five months because he managed to eek out a decision once out of his four fights with Carter. He lost to everybody, and was still fighting at fw when Saddler beat him anyway. And we cant discuss Saddler stopping Demarco on a cut in a close fight without mentioning how Demarco came back to defeat saddler twice in fights that werent nearly as close as the scorecards had them.

 

Facts: 3 dead, 20 injured. Pep had a broken left leg and some rib injuries. His condition was reported as good next day after the crash. Later an x-ray revealed he had two split and chipped vertebrae which were said to be "neither serious nor uncommon." He was back in the gym by mid-May and back in the ring a month later with an easy victory over a tune-up opponent, "displaying much of his old-time prowess and speed".

 

There was a 4 1/4 pounds difference at the weigh-in. Angott was previously beaten by at least two other featherweights. Pep had a lot of fights vs lightweights previous to meeting Angott.