What if Robinson fought maxim on a cooler day?

Exactly.

Further, we have to factor in that not only was Robinson moving more, Robinson pushing physically against the much larger man is more exhausting in than Maxim having to push physically against the much smaller man, especially so in the conditions they fought in.

In this fight I think the stars aligned perfectly for Maxim, the way he won this is extremely likely the only set of circumstances in wich he could beat Robinson.

 

The voice of sanity.:good

 

You are either TRYING to lie purposely to support your argument or you havent seen these fights.

Go watch them. How did Maxim fight a neophyte Patterson differently than Robinson? Because I see a circling, jabbing, clincher against Patterson who was fighting exactly like he fought against Robinson. And guess what, he fought that exact same way against Moore in their three fights, Charles in the two fights we have filmed, Murphy, Olson, Nardico, Andrews, Romero, and everyone else. He did fight a slightly different fight against Mills but not because he was being more aggressive it was because Mills was more aggressive than anyone we have him on film against and forced in an inside fight. It was still the same old Maxim, jabbing and clinching. The commentator even makes comment of this several times. Sorry pal, but you have absolutely zero evidence that Maxim fought a different fight because of the heat or because he was against a smaller opponent. Of the 14 fights he fought between May 1951 and September 1956 I have 12. He fought Robinson in the summer of 1952. In addition to that I have fights that took place before and after, against HWs, LHWs, and MWs, indoors, outdoors, summer, winter, hot, cold, against boxers and brawlers and Maxim didnt fight any differently against Robinson than he did against anyone else. I can say with absolute certainty from about as comprehensive a cross section of him as you can get at the time that he was ALWAYS a conservative, circling, jabbing, clinching spoiler. Period. I also have dozens and dozens of fights of Robinson from his amateur days all the way up to his last fight, fighting featherweights, lightweights, welterweights, middleweights, and yes even lightheavyweights (PLURAL) and I cant ever recall a time Robinson faded down the stretch and collapsed without getting hit while mumbling incoherently in a fight that he was not only winning by a country mile but that wasnt either difficult or hard to score. So dont sit there and try to tell me some agenda driven nonsense that the heat effected Maxim as much or more than Robinson, that Maxim had to fight a different fight and somehow would have been much faster, stronger, harder hitting, or more aggressive (all things he was NOT) in air conditioning, and that he was fighting some brilliant master plan whereby he would eat punches all night long, rarely score, and hope Robinson collapsed without getting hit. Absolute, utter bull****. And definately dont come here and tell me Maxim was way more aggressive against a green Patterson and that he won that fight because it wasnt hot because he didnt even ****ing win that fight. It was a ridiculous robbery with Patterson the one who was making the fight, landing more, and landing harder. Maxim laid back in that fight and did nothing but pop jabs that wouldnt break a wet paper bag and clinch whenever he had a chance. Jesus. The degree some people go in order to try to defend a hopeless cause is a joke.

 

Maybe or even a dozen other scenarios.

Let's see here...we covered this previously.


"I like this style of trolling, you appear to be rolling.

You restate the opposing argument but exaggerate and make left field additions you know they didn't make to the point it no longer resembles the original statement, just so you can dismiss it as people making **** up, when you are the one that fabricated the claim. I might really love this style.

In retort, I say to you, show me footage where Maxim plodded forward continuously eating punches like a human heavy bag and throwing nothing but a few body punches. I swear people just make **** up."

 

He's just a troll who thinks he is 100 times smarter and funnier than he is. IGNORE!

 

Goldstein was not some Joe Schmo off the street. He was a fit man who from his own ring career knew very well how to pace himself, and he did NOT work anything like as hard as the fighters. For a start he is not expending energy either throwing or avoiding punches. The pace of the fight was not fast so he didn't need to run around like a headless chicken when keeping an eye on the fighters in the clinches. These clinches will obviously sap the energy of the lighter man in any conditions, all the heat did was magnify the outcome.

As for your animal ****ogy, what is the average age reached by an elephant, unless some human kunt kills it for its ivory? Only last I heard they came in 2 kinds, African, and Indian, both are rather big animals, and both dwell in rather warm climates.

 

John Thomas got in before me, but as asked what Middles did he fight in those conditions?

 

See the answer above to Wass.

Again Ruby was no mug. He had refereed top class fights for 10 years prior to this one. Are you going to tell me he had never worked as hard reffing a fight up until that time, or never worked as hard reffing a fight for the following 12 years? Because to the best of my knowledge he never collapsed and had to be replaced before or after.

 

I refused to engage further with a closed mind.

 

Yes, he clearly was moving so much because he was in there with a bigger man. Haven't read through, but has anyone really disputed this?

The questions related to this thread topic are rather: 1. Could he have sustained such pace and movement for 15 rds in cooler conditions? 2. Would Maxim, in cooler conditions, upped his tempo enough not to be outboxed by Robinson?

I'd have to answer "quite likely" to question 1. He probably could. He seemed to be that well conditioned still, going by previous fights.

As for question 2, I personally haven't watched any other fight with Maxim, so I don't know how good he was at pressing a fight.

 

You asked if he was working harder than the fighters.

It was observed by the announcer in round 2 "Notice Ruby Goldstein trying to keep all punches in sight does a lot more moving than Maxim. "

 

All of his life, Maximum heard "the heat beat Robinson". He had one stock reply: "It was no ****ing cooler in my corner than his"

 

Spot on.....

 

The ref might have been **** poor at handling the heat. I know fit people who detest the heat whilst on holiday yet I know fat slobs who love it.

Of course it's fair to say that Robinson could have won if it was cooler as he was doing most the work. But I don't know and you certainly don't know how the heat affected Maxim.

If you want to get technical there's 5 types of elephant.....

 

With less heat Robinson clearly doesn't have to quit.

What's unclear is how the lesser heat would effect Maxim. Would he be more active? Would he be able to impose his will on the smaller man? Would he even be more aggressive?

I'm dead against the people who treat their fight as a Robinson victory because it wasn't, he didn't last the distance, but obviously he was beating him clearly at the time.

I am not sure who I'd favour, well I am, I'd favour Robinson, but it's by no means a certainty.