Canelo has not OFFICIALLY ducked GGG (Yet)

He tried to hold the belt hostage by only wanting to defend it at 155. If he could have gotten away with it, he would have done. But as soon as the WBC backed GG he had to relinquish it.

The WBC and GG weren't making demands. They just wanted the fight to be signed according to the rules of boxing.

Why the hell does a lineal MW champ want to drop back to fight Liam Smith?

 

Holding a belt / division hostage involves not defending a title over a long period of time without the belt holder being forced to vacate. Like Floyd holding the 154-lb belts for 2+ years without having to defend it. The 154-lb division was held hostage during that time, meaning there were no title fights during that time period.

We keep hearing that Canelo only wanted to defend that title at 155. I disagree. Please examine the two fights Canelo had for that title and make an honest determination as to who wanted those fights at 155.

Very, very clearly : Cotto wanted his fight with Canelo at 155.
And very, very clearly : Khan wanted his fight with Canelo at 155.

Khan stated unequivocally that he wouldn’t have fought Canelo at any weight other than 155. So it’s really inaccurate to say that Canelo wanted to defend that title at 155. What Canelo wanted to do was to rematch Floyd for the 154-lb titles, but Floyd didn’t. When he couldn’t re-capture his title, he took non-title fights, and since they were non-title fights he weighed in at 155. Then the public / media demanded Canelo fight Cotto. So Canelo obliged and became the MW Champ.

Canelo had no interest in fighting Middleweights and draining them to 155 (like Cotto did) so he took on Khan who wanted the 155 catchweight. It was a fair compromise and a good fight, and a great win for Canelo. Then he dropped the title so he wouldn’t be holding the MW division hostage so to speak.

Yes they were, they were forcing Canelo to agree within 2 and a half weeks after beating Khan to GG’s terms. GG’s side were putting pressure on Canelo to sign on the dotted line. They had every right to do so but they were for sure making demands since Canelo was holding that belt.

Well, I think the answer to that is that the lineal MW champ isn’t a full MW. He’s never fought a real Middleweight. (Cotto was less than 154-lbs when he won the title from him, and Cotto, the former lineal MW Champ is now ranked once again at LMW)

We all know that MW has been messed up ever since Martinez became injured and Cotto, a blown up welterweight took the title off of him. At least Canelo wasn’t draining Middleweights while defending that title like Cotto, which in my view is worse than a welterweight with a big frame like Khan gaining 8 lbs and meeting him at 155.

But obviously both Cotto and Canelo weren’t defending the lineal MW title the way it should be defended (at 160) so I understand your frustration.

As to Canelo “dropping back down” to 154 for a possible Liam Smith fight, well the answer is simple. Liam has the WBO LMW Title, that's a title Canelo has never held before and it’s frankly a good fight. If Liam can get past his opponent this weekend it’s a fight that I will be looking forward to.

Canelo really never moved up to MW fully, so he’s not really dropping down so much as he just has to lose 1 additional lb from what he’s been weighing in at. I think another thing to point out is that Canelo may not be able to make 154 in another year or two, so he may as well take this opportunity to capture another 154-lb title while he can still make LMW limit. Also it could re-establish himself as the man at LMW as he had practically cleaned out that division before fighting Cotto.

If Smith wins this weekend, and if Canelo were to defeat Smith later this year and capture that title, Canelo could once again be a World Champion and it could help build up a move up to 160 next year to fight GG.

I think Canelo is a unique position here, and while I very much prefer to see Canelo vs GG happen as soon as possible, I would welcome a Canelo vs Smith fight for the WBO title as that could be a good experience for Canelo. A fight with GG could still be possible in 2017.

Once Canelo challenges GG at the full 160, it’s likely he’ll never fight at 154 again, so while he can make that weight, it makes sense to fight Smith and win another World Title. I think it’s important to remember also that while Canelo is the Lineal MW Champion, the public / media really pushed for Canelo to fight Cotto and Canelo took the fight and won that title. I don’t think it’s fair to hate on Canelo for not fighting at 160 when Cotto wasn’t fighting at 160 either and Cotto essentially vacated that title as well. Now that title is held by a real MW, though Canelo is still the Ring Magazine / Lineal MW Champ. I think it would really be quite an accomplishment for Canelo win another title at 154 while being the Lineal MW Champ. In a way I think it makes a fight with GG even more intriguing if he can take the 154-lb WBO title into a Super Fight with GG.

None of this is ordinary for a Lineal MW Champion, and I understand your frustration, but I personally am rooting for Smith this weekend to see if the fight can be made. Canelo is a big enough star where he should be fighting for World Titles. Styles make fights and if it happens, I think Canelo vs Smith would actually be a good stylistic matchup.

Don’t get me wrong : I want to see Canelo vs GG. If Canelo vs Smith happens later this year, if GG’s goal is to unify the MW division, then he could fight Jacobs to become Unified MW Champ, then fight Canelo for all the MW titles in 2017.

I actually am disappointed that the WBC just gave GG the title after Canelo vacated. I thought GG should have to win that vacant title in the ring by fighting a new #1 contender at MW. The situation will be interesting though, because with Canelo still as the Ring Magazine / Lineal MW Champ, even if GG captures all the MW titles, he won’t truly be Unified Champ until he beats the Man who beat the Man who beat the Man at MW (Martinez), as I’m not sure there’s ever been a Unified Champ who hasn’t beat the Lineal Champ.
:deal

 

Well if you drop your belt, title or whatever you want to call it to avoid your mandatory and then make an offer to Liam Smith at 154 it is now safe to say it was a blatant duck.

Any other fighter would be given dogs abuse for doing the same and rightly so.

 

I don’t think so, because ducking someone really doesn’t have anything to do with the belts. It has to do with not wanting to fight someone. i.e. Floyd ducked Manny Pacquiao for 6 years and it had nothing to do with the belts. It had to do with Floyd not wanting to fight Manny period.

GG was “Canelo’s” mandatory before he ever even won the MW title from Cotto. Cotto not paying the sanctioning fees could be interpreted as a duck, though Cotto says that he already had to pay GG 800k step-aside money to fight Canelo instead and didn’t want to pay an additional 300k or whatever it was in addition to that.

I think it’s clear that neither Cotto or Canelo are really Middleweights, so it’s hard to say they are ducking someone in a weight division above theirs. It would be like saying GG is ducking Ward because he prefers fighting at 160 instead of 168.

Same thing with Canelo and Cotto. They prefer to fight at 154 rather than 160, but I don’t think you can blame Cotto for stepping up to fight Martinez or for Canelo to fight Cotto. Those were fights that the public / media demanded.

I just think generally there’s a glass half empty view of Canelo instead of a glass half full view of him. With him being Lineal MW Champ, that should make GG to want to FIGHT the Lineal MW champ, even after he vacated the WBC Belt. How can GG consider himself the Unified MW champ if he hasn’t beatn the Lineal Champ. That should be more of a problem for GG than it is for Canelo as Canelo isn’t even a real MW (Yet).

Ducking somebody really has nothing to do with belts. It has to do with not wanting to fight someone. Now that GG has the WBC belt, if he don’t think it’s necessary to fight Canelo, then isn’t he ducking Canelo? I just don’t see how GG can ever be considered unified MW Champ if he doesn’t beat the Lineal MW Champ. That should be more important to GG than it is to Canelo, as MW is GG’s Division, not Canelo’s.

 

He held it hostage by having the championship and not facing the next best MW.

You know exactly what diva demands have been made as there's enough threads on it.

I'm glad he's ran back to LMW, means the proper MW men van get on with fighting each other.

 

Some of you can't help but shoot your load over false information. As it turns out it was Smith who made the offer

 

No way will El Pollo fight Golovkin....................

 

Holding a belt / division hostage is when a fighter is allowed to hold a belt for a long period of time without defending it, preventing other deserving contenders from gaining title opportunities. In the case of the MW division there were no clear #1 contenders deserving a title opportunity. (aside from GG of course in the case of the WBC mandatory, but it wasn’t like he was ranked #1, he was already holding other titles at MW and had requirements to defend those other titles)

It is uncommon for a newly crowned Champion to be forced into a “mandatory” as the first defense of a title, in this case, a guy (GG) that already held other titles at MW. It’s more common for a newly crowned champion to be given at least one voluntary title defense before having to fight a mandatory let alone a unification fight.

He held that title for barely 6 months, he had a voluntary title defense, and Amir Khan was willing to come up. Then instead of holding the title hostage, he vacated the title. Any way you slice it, there’s simply no way you can argue that Canelo was holding that title hostage. Floyd held the 154-lb titles for 4 times as long without a single Title Fight at Light Middleweight. That’s holding a division hostage.

I don’t have any idea what diva demands you are referring to. A lot of people make up stuff here on this forum to make Canelo look bad. Likely you believe stuff that never happened because you are trying to find reasons to hate on Canelo. Please list all the “diva demands” that Canelo has made and then we can all examine if they are legitimate.

Well he never really left LMW. As I explained, he was unable to re-capture the 154-lb title(s) that Floyd got via MD, due to the commissions allowing Floyd to hold that division hostage for 2+ years without having to defend or vacate those titles. So what was Canelo supposed to do? After some non-title fights, it was clear that the biggest fight out there was to fight Cotto. It was the fight that the boxing media was pushing and the public seemed excited about.

So Canelo beats Cotto a future HOFer then all of a sudden he’s thrust into being called a ducker for not immediately fighting GG at a weight he’s never fought at in his first title defense. I still don’t think he regrets fighting Cotto though as having that name on his resume and holding a MW title, being the Lineal MW champ is a huge accomplishment in boxing. Haters gonna hate, you’re not going to satisfy everyone and given all facts I think Canelo’s made the right decisions and I look forward to seeing where he goes from here.

 

Well yes, he should have fought Golovkin and didn't do. If he's still claiming to be MW champion then even right now he's holding it hostage.

Why do you keep going on about Floyd? We're on about Canelo refusing to fight G.

If you're totally unaware then you need to read up, I'm not here to educate you, I'm here to express my happiness at Canelo's choice.

Hate is a strong word, why would I hate him? En contraire I'll probably buy his next fight which contributes towards making him richer.

Well he did leave LMW. He fought Cotto for the MW championship. Sounded off about fighting Golovkin for the MW championship. Defended against Khan for the MW championship. I remember you previously saying you felt he vacated so he could have more time to negotiate a MW fight with Golovkin.

He has made the right decision, he's left the division behind because he knows he is too small for MW. I'm happy he's done this.