Monzon vs Hagler, 1977 or 1978

Monzon fought plenty of good sized middles and defended against 7 of them 2 of them twice.
Bogs
Mundine
Tonna
Benvenuti
Valdes
Bouttier
Briscoe.

Valdes was over the hill ?No more than Monzon was ,and he still had enough left to beat Briscoe for the title after Monzon retired Any criticism of Monzon for fighting 2 small challengers in Napoles the reigning welter weight king and Griffith the number 2 contender is nullified by Hagler defending against.
Leonard a natural welter
Mugabi a natural light middle
Hearns a natural light middle
Duran a natural lightweight
Antuofermo a natural light middle
You are trying to make 2=2 into 5 and it won't happen! Periodically you try to disparage Monzon with silly talk about he never faced a big puncher.
His challengers were small etc
You get blown away each time, but still revisit the same old tired myths from time to time.
No doubt you will again,and with the same result!

 

Well said

 

:good

 

at first my view was that a young Hagler could take him but afterwards viewed his last fight w Valdez and reconsidered

Monzon was far from done

Even tho Hagler was a spectacular fighter at the time and would never fall short again, something tells me he would fall short against same year Monzon

1980-1983 Hagler is a different story. Hagler had the reach, the jab and his southpaw style tells me that hagler circling to his right would totally negate Monzon's left jab. and forget about Monzon's right hand landing square; Hagler is too skilled a defensive fighter

Monzon's hook would be easy to slip, and would be met with rib cracking right hooks

Even the toughest most elite fighter has their limits and King Carlos would find this to be a real ordeal thinking "is there no way to survive against such fury?" (ala Thomas Hearns)

How long he would last is anyone's guess but most likely, King Carlos would drop his guard to better protect his aching ribs until Hagler bring his right hook up to the temple (ala Fully Obel 2). The End

 

Greetings Red. We all have our (including my own) biased opinions.
A prime Carlos-Marvin would have been great! I see Carlos taking a UD. Of course I could bring up the eras thing again with Monzon's constant workload before becoming Champ vs. Marvin's basic "a fight every 5-6 months. mantra as he was maturing. It would have been a great fight pvp. nonetheless. Let's let everyone have their say...

 

Well said

 

Two ATG middles both top 4 ,with Hagler being easier on the eye to watch imo.

 

For my money the best two middleweights of the modern era

 

I agree:good

 

Sorry Red but I don't see a ''The End" for Carlos in his prime against ANY MW which, with eras considered, we may have never seen him completely in prime. IMO if Marvin had labored as actively in the 70's as Carlos did in the 60's he wouldn't be quite the wrecking machine he became in the 80's. Again...eras...and early workload. Feel free to disagree but the 60's may well have been the last decade of many fighters fighting almost constantly.
I always bring up SRR who IS THE greatest pvp fighter of all time. Let Duran or Hagler or Leonard or Hearns fight once a month during their reigns and you are, for sure, going to see several losses in there. Monzon won all his early losses/draws rematches
...just saying

 

Red I stand corrected a bit in that Hagler had a pretty constant workload on his way up. I still go the Carlos UD but I was wrong in my assessment of Marvin's early career. Please accept my apology.

 

I didnt actually see any of the big names until 1970, Benvenuti being the top man

almost all his fights were local fights in his home country or continent

hagler did take out two of the best Argentines Cabrera, & Roldan. I have those fights. neither was easy but he took them both out

Corro was the best man by 1978 but Hagler could not get a fight with him

the best complement I could give the argentine middleweights is that Vito said Corro was a more difficult fighter than Hagler (1979 version only)

whatever, I don't think the competition was critical but more so the styles

what do we know?

we know that Marvin being a southpaw would move in the opposite direction to what Carlos is accustomed to facing

hagler on the other hand had no such disadvantage and being shorter, had less body to hit (as compared with long exposed body of Monzon which Hagler would no doubt exploit)

we know that Marvin would be in excellent condition and able to match Monzon in stamina

he outlasted Roldan and did you see the Hearns fight?

We know he did well against taller opponents, a testimony to his preparation

We know that he would beat Monzon to the punch with his jab

because how is Monzon going to land his left jab with Marvin circling to Monzon's left?

say what you want about level of competition and middleweight size but this is a bad matchup for Monzon stylistically speaking

Marvin could box and wielded one of the best jabs in history regardless of weight class and you know he's going to use it here

The difference between Hagler & Briscoe is that Marvin used use his jab with surgeon-like precision, had much better mobility, and wasn't clumsy and slow like Briscoe (no offense meant)

His offense was much smoother, and on defense, no comparison

The story would be Marvin's precise right jab, then hook under Monzon's missed left. Those fearfully exposed ribs. none of his previous opponents was talented enough to get it done

the closest scare I saw Monzon have was in the second fight with Briscoe when sometime after the 10th, Monzon was caught. I seen it from different camera angles and he was definitely hurt near the corner

I see Marvin however doing the job not with one shot but an accumulation of jabs, hooks to the body and head

Monzon is lying flat no later than eight

 

i will say Monzon would have had a field day with 1987 Hagler

who wouldn't?

 

atsch

 

it's a fight, not a script, remember?

what do you expect someone like Hagler to do, trade jabs with him all night long and forget everything else?