Lennox Lewis vs. Chris Byrd.

Byrd wins the early rds with his awkwardness and skills but somewhere around rond 6-8 Lewis KO's him and brutally!

 

I think Lewis beats him

I don't think those that disagree with me are morons,,,

I just think they are incorrect.

 

I never said Byrd or Moorer would win. I said I wouldn't expect them to win.
"COULD" Byrd or Moorer win ? Of course, even if their chances are slim, they were world class boxers after all.

You said Lewis "dominates them with ease". Maybe he would but it's giving him too much credit to state it like it's a fact.

There are thousands of ways to win a fight.
Since I wouldn't expect Byrd or Moorer to win, I can't be bothered to imagine ways in which they could. But of course there's a chance they could.
Until two fighters meet you can't know for sure what will happen, especially with two fighters who generally adopt strategic boxing styles.

He never faced a world class southpaw.
To assume that Lennox Lewis could only ever be defeated by way of a strong right hand ala Rahman/McCall makes no sense either.
I think there are fighters out there in history who'd beat him primarily with a left jab, and I have no way of knowing whether he'd deal with a right southpaw jab any better than he would deal with a good left jab.
To assume he only has one vital weakness because he only ever loss due to right hands doesn't make sense to me when I consider matching him with completely different fighters and styles he never faced.

Well, this is what I've been saying.
And, no, we don't "PROVE" things here. When we match up two fighters who never met in a hypothetical fantasy match we don't get to "prove" anything.

 

OK so let me get this straight you think it's a legitimate question based on nothing then? As you don't think any of the southpaws he could of faced had much of a chance, your simply exploring hypothetical's to an extreme even if the likely hood of the answer is skewered greatly towards one result?

If so I get your thinking, I've met people who think like that and find them infuriating as I find the extreme they go to, in looking at all possibilities, especially if their conjectured outcome is so remote.

I personally would want some kind of sign that Lewis had a stylistic weakness to southpaws for me to regard it as a legitimate question. I prefer to base my opinions on things I actually see rather than imagined flaws that may or may not be there. But maybe you're right and Lewis would have struggled against a southpaw, but I just don't see it myself.

 

Lennox clearly avoided southpaw fighters, which is why he gave up the IBF belt rather than face Chris Byrd.. Corrie Sanders fought on a few Lewis undercards, and was thought of as a possible opponent for Lewis 94-99 (claimed by Lewis promotional compant in McCall (1) fight programme).. Lennox told in a SKY Sports Ringside interview, how he avoided Michael Moorer in 96/97 due to Moorer being a southpaw.

CHRIS BYRD Interview "Why didn't Lennox Lewis want to fight me?" - YouTube

Lennox Lewis Sky Special - YouTube

 

He gave up the IBF belt because there was little interest in the fight. You may believe differently but the facts are pretty clear. HBO wanted Holyfield/Byrd, while they would have accepted Lewis/Byrd they were not clamoring for it. Byrd's own promoter paid Lewis to drop the belt, if Byrd's own promoter didn't want the fight how was it that Lewis ducked Byrd? Lewis didn't wan't it, HBO didn't really want it, King didn't want it, most fans didn't want it, but hey lets put all the blame on Lewis for not forcing what was seen then as a stinker of a fight which was thought to be a foregone conclusion.

Sanders was never more than a fringe contender nobody was ducking him because nobody really cared about him. He was never mandatory, he never beat a big enough name to earn a shot, until after he beat Wlad. He fought on one Lewis undercard beating Arthur Weathers who was coming off 3 straight losses, if you think he deserved a shot at Lewis then, then you're nuts, especially as a shot Weathers dropped Sanders. Maybe had Sanders beat Rahman he would have got the shot at Lewis in South Africa in front of a home crowd, that would have made sense, but Sanders simply wasn't good enough to beat an overweight Rahman and Lewis couldn't probably sell a fight against an opponent who had lost so recently even in front of his home fans.

As for Moorer, how did Lewis duck Moorer? When Moorer beat Evander for the title he was asked about unifying and Moorer said he had no interest in unifying. How many champions say that? Even Moorer promoter said that Moorer hadn't made enough money to turn down such a lucrative fight. Yet what happened, he fought Foreman instead, probably regarded as a safer money fight than unifying with Lewis, well that backfired. Moorer wanted no part of Lewis, you can't deny it, Moorer's own words contradict your opinion. But keep lying to yourself.

 

You whole argument, is based on your own theory and opinion. The facts are as posted. Lewis himself tells how he avoided Moorer, in the Video provided. Chris Byrd himself, talks how Lewis ducked him. For you to claim HBO wanted Holyfieldv Byrd instead of Lewis vs Byrd is laughable. Same as claiming, "Nobody wanted that fight".. which is ridiculous. Lewis also dropped the WBA belt to avoid John Ruiz and instead of fighting Ruiz, Lewis fought the murderous Frans Botha..... Lennox says "he avoided Moorer", but you are saying he didn't.

 

Lewis, absolutely.

 

Well, you must find boxing quite boring if you're never willing to entertain the possibilities of unlikely results or fights panning out in various way, virtually shutting off all curiosity in how two styles will mesh when they bell rings.

I mean, I'm known to be fairly cynical about matchmaking in boxing but I do try to open my mind to the fact that I don't actually know what will occur when the bell rings, especially in a heavyweight fight between world class boxers. Even in fights where I clearly favour a man to win I tend to maintain interest by accepting things often don't go as my best guess would forsee.
I doubt I could even drag myself to watch most the fights I have watched if I though it was all so clear cut and forseeable as you do.
And, believe me, I don't watch an awful lot nowadays mostly for the fact that I think the matches are fraudulent.

I can't remember anyone saying Lewis-Rahman 1 would be a particularly interesting fight "... because Rahman has a great right hand ... he might KO Lewis !" ... NO, it was considered a routine fight and Rahman really had no realistic chance, but I watched it regardless, and in the moments before the first bell rang their was still a sense of anticipation and excitement because it's two men pitting their skills and styles together with everything at stake. And no one forsaw the result.
Conversely, Lewis-Tua had been dull and one-sided, but Tua had actually been built up to stand a great chance of making it as competitive and interesting contest, a lot of pundits expected the styles to mesh much better than they did.

There's always an element of unknown, and Chris Byrd was certainly the type of style that raises questions of every fighter. Whether Lewis blasts him out in 1 round or has a tougher fight, we don't know how it will look until we see it.

 

I would like to examine some of these facts you've been citing...

Could you please point to the time, in the Sky Special video you have posted, when Lewis admits to Johnny Nelson and Adam Smith that he avoided Moorer, due to him being a southpaw?

Could you also please respond to my prior request on the source of information, upon which you have previously stated: "Stewart said, the most likely result of [Lewis and Byrd] fighting would be, Byrd making Lewis look foolish, and Byrd winning a clear points decision."?


I don't really consider Byrd's opinion as representing the facts behind why Lewis didn't want to fight him. The facts are that a fight with Byrd was considered unmarketable; King wanted Lewis to vacate (he actually advised Lewis to retire) and was prepared to pay Lewis $1M to get his way and set up the bout with Holyfield. There's little else to be said about this.

By the way, Lewis did not drop the WBA belt to fight Botha. Lewis vacated the strap because the WBA had agreed that Lewis could face Michael Grant before facing Ruiz - but King got involved and took the WBA to court, in order to reverse that agreement and place Ruiz as the immediate mandatory for Lewis. The Judge sided with King. Lewis signed to fight Grant, as had previously been agreed. King knew Lewis would do so. It was an easy land grab for him.

 

it is pointless me putting up links etc for you, as you already have your mind made up, on what you deem the facts of the matter are and how they unravelled..

To claim Byrd's opinion is "NOT representing the facts" is simply bazaar.. What is your opinion of this video below?

▶ So Much to Talk About: Riddick Bowe (June 2009)-Pt. 4 of 5 - YouTube

 

What is "pointless" is you putting up links to interviews, claiming that they contain revelations, which they actually do not.

What is equally pointless and, at the same time, somewhat cretinous, is claiming that someone made a statement (which just happens to fit your point of view), without supporting the claim with a source of the citation - I have asked if you could provide this, twice.

Bear in mind that most of the people on the forum will have looked into these matters before; perhaps for many years. As such, it is not unusual for people to have drawn a line under their conclusions on a topic - unless, of course, new and credible evidence is presented, which might shed a different light on the issue. You have not presented any such evidence.

Whilst it's all very well listening to Boxers reminisce on the whys and wherefores of why a fight didn't happened, it is usually rooted in nothing but a sheer opinion of theirs, without any extra facts actually being added to the case. The fact they have aired this opinion of theirs does not mean that their opinion is, in itself, a fact. If you think this is a bizarre way of looking at it then you perhaps ought to understand the difference between opinion, fact and how critical evaluation of both might be applied.

A simple example would be Lennox Lewis' own take on his defeat to Rahman, in the Sky Sports Special interview, you posted. Whilst it is a fact that, during the interview, Lewis made his thoughts known about that bout and the cause behind its outcome, I do not necessarily agree with his opinion, as to why he suffered that knockout loss.

 

what a load of tripe you have posted in reply lol. i've obviously caught you out. Your trying to make claim, "it's ok for Lewis to drop belts" and avoid No1 contenders. But it is not ok for Riddick Bowe to do it. It is ok for Lennox Lewis to say, "He is no threat to me" but not ok for Chris Byrd to make claim Lewis was ducking him. lol

 

Sanders vs Rahamn bout was an eliminator to fight Lewis . Rahman won. He got the shot. Manny rightfully said Byrd wasn't good enough to be hired as a sparring partner. They only brough guys in over 220 pound.
Lewis simply did not want the embarrassment of sharing the ring with puff'd up 175 pound feather duster

 

You think you have caught me out? I think you've been well and truly found out - but Ill give you one more chance...

• Please provide the source for your claim that Manny Steward said: "the most likely result of [Lewis and Byrd] fighting would be, Byrd making Lewis look foolish, and Byrd winning a clear points decision."

• Please provide a time index for the point in the Sky Sports Special video that you posted; the interview in which you claim Lewis admitted that he avoided Moorer, due to him being a Southpaw.

• At which point did I bring Riddick Bowe into the debate and/or put forward any points concerning Bowe?

I don't think you can meet the above requests, although I'm prepared to receive the references and then look at them. If you cannot then this and a truthful answer to the third point will just add to the fact that you make claims and argue points founded upon your own brand of manure, with no basis in reality...