Pick a HW to beat Prime Tyson.

The key to beat Tyson is to know what he is going to do before he does it. Can't do that, you can't beat him no matter how tall, fast or strong you are. It is a tall order but Tyson was a programmed fighter. There was a sequence to follow.

It isn't a certain style. It isn't a certain height or punch. It's knowing what Ttson is going to do before he can do it, and obviously being good enough to fight to fight to the finish with him.


Easier said than done!

 

I think I've picked a fairly disparate list of names and sizes.

 

Yeah , everybody had a jab , but the difference was in quality. It took Lewis over half a career and a paring with Steward before he threw a good jab and even then i don't think he ever threw a jab as good as Douglas , especially Busters jab in the Tyson fight.

Lewis mainly beat Tyson because he was shot to bits , on drugs and not 100% mentally tuned in. Lewis Beating Tyson in 2003 says nothing at all about how he would do against a Rooney trained Tyson of 87/88.
But Lewis had a decent uppercut , thats how he beat his ghost and it would give him success against any version. But he wasn't quick enough and spent too much time around the same spot if we're taking the dredded era Lewis and not the flawed flat topped version.
Tyson beats that Lewis to the punch and demolishes the younger version with counters similar to how MaCall ws able to find the openings pretty easily

 

Rosenbloom

 

Ali
Louis
Holmes
Foreman
Lewis
Holyfield
Vitali

All those have a good shot IMO.

 

Tyson was fast, he would make an opening (usually draw a jab) then pounce using angles to attack on the blind side. His foot work was excelent and his hands fast. But if you watch, Douglas feinted with the jab that Tyson wanted to draw from him. Tyson was buying these feints. As Tyson stepped in with his head moving side to side, Douglas had him trapped. Buster could stop Tyson with a double jab because he knew what way Tysons head was going to go. After he bobbed left he went right. It was always side to side. Tyson was showing Douglas this each time he was fiented out of position. He could reach him because Tyson had committed himself. Watch Lewis too. He used this.

Quite sophisticated but it's all there.

 

Vitali would get bashed up same as Tony Tucker. Vitali wasn't any better than Tucker.

Even Golota had a higher skill level than Vitali and he was obliterated by past prime Tyson.

 

Douglas has got to make everyone's list surely.

 

This is the only guy I'd give an even chance against prime Tyson.
And he'd have to be in this type of condition too :

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This is some what true .lol
Im not sure why people are also using Douglas because the fight took place in 1990 and was without Rooney and his sole loss at near peak level in a fight clearly not prepared for.

 

No It is not as simple as that or anyone would have success with the double jab and feint. That's why I said it was a tall order.

If you feinted then double jabbed without repositioning or reading the next part it would not work.

It's the knowing what Tyson was going to do before he did it so as to position him perfectly for a counter (Douglas used a double jab but it could be a combination or a single punch) and the being able to stand up to him. The feint got both of them into position

So Douglas worked off the feint beautifully. It wasn't the feint in itself though. it was the faint together with the positioning and reading how Tyson responded to the feint.

Crucially Douglas repositioned himself too. There is a lot going on when you watch how Douglas orchestrated it. Feint, reposition, counter, reposition.

Tyson couldn't stop the way he was doing things. He just kept on doing them and kept on getting caught. He did not give up. I will give him that.

It's just not the case of predicting one type of fighter being wrong for Tyson. Or a case of "style match up" because Tyson destroyed good tall guys with a jab that were like Douglas.

 

IMO no HW in history defeats a prime Tyson except for M Ali...actually I mean the
young Cassius Clay. The reason is not physical,
it's psychological. Ali would have messed with Tyson's fragile psyche during press meetings.
Probably would have shown up at Tyson's training sessions. Tyson would have folded like a deck
of cards under that mental pressure, I believe. In the actual fight (remember this is Clay, not the older
Ali) Clay would have danced like a ballet master around Tyson, making Tyson miss until he became
frustrated as hell. Ali would have jabbed his face into a pulp. The end comes like the Douglas bout;
Tyson rolling around the canvas looking for his mouthpiece.

Otherwise, Prime Tyson beats them all. Some great close fights...I'm not saying he KO's everyone...
but wins nonetheless.

On second thought...maybe Jack Johnson plays with his head pre-fight enough to chip away at
Mike. I can hear Johnson saying "hit me in the stomach, Mikey; it don't hurt much".

 

Even with Rooney I think a lot of what beat Tyson was not having enough tough fights to draw upon when he was finally taken into deep water. He was young, so very young, he had been fast tracked to the title and was not yet equipped for a tough fight. Even great fighters are not perfect. He was too used to success. It happened to Joe Louis too.

Sometimes the lesser fighter is more used to things not going His way.