Dempsey v Liston...

Not many heavyweights are going to beat monster Liston....Dempsey should have been able too..Dempsey did very very well against strong sluggers who could take it mainly cause he hit and could take it also but was almost twice as fast and was a bit deranged...from one to 15. This could end...Dempsey is too versatile and lethal..interesting fight...

 

Krishna Wainwright went the full 6 with Tua
Ruiz folded in 19 seconds

I don't see Dempsey getting cut off, but solid write up.

 

In whacking out Patterson twice, Liston beat something closer to Dempsey than Dempsey ever beat something close to Liston.

 

That's right. But Patterson is no prime Dempsey.

 

Did Dempsey have a deeper resume at heavyweight than Moore, Machen, Chuvalo, Johansen, Cooper, Bonavena and quite arguably Quarry? I think not.

 

Firpo = Liston

 

Didnt you know Gibbons is more of a threat who is 35 pounds less ,no ramrod jab ,leads with his head straight in most of the time , is the better fighter than monster Liston who planted 175 pounders ? lol

These guys want to bring up Gibbons but if he went 15 with Dempsey how does Dempsey K.O Liston in 2 ??? Utter foolishness !

 

At first, this seems like a cruiserweight versus a modern heavyweight. But, there are things to consider: Dempsey's punching power, mobility, speed, chin and ferocity. Liston appears somewhat slow and immobile. Dempsey by KO!

 

A post from the boxing artcle on Bill Tate ...Dempsey sparring

[url]https://cdnc.ucr.edu/cgi-bin/cdnc?a=d&d=SU19220115.2.141‎[/url]

"Bill is a slow starter and has to get cracker! good and hard to rouse his fighting instinct, but once he gets
his ire up. watch out. He has the best left hand I have ever seen on a heavyweight. And he knows linw to use it. He is just as fast on his feet as Dempsey and. best of all. he ran take a terrific lacing. Dempsey may have knocked him down a few times during the period he was training for Jess Willard. hut he never did it after that. As many times as I have seen Tate and Dempsey box together I never saw Tate dazed. And everyone knows how Dempsey socks in training. “People were under the impression, after reading all of the wonderful accounts of the training camp routing, that Tate was a mere punching bag for the champion. This 1 know to be a very false impression. Tate always managed to extend the champ and I have yet to see him take much the worst of It from* the champ or anyone else."

Looking at some footage of the sessions , i have no doubt Liston wins ,Dempsey looks lost and outmatched ,Listons jab would pulverize Dempsey and he would be manhandled.

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Bwahaha!

 

Dempsey has too much hand speed, foot speed, lateral movement, power, bob, weave and stamina (KO 12 Brennan, W 15 Tommy Gibbons) for this one. Liston won't have a tall and stationary target with questionable chin like Cleveland Williams, or a deer in the headlights like Patterson, and Ali showed in both bouts with Sonny that his right could buckle and drop Liston.

I don't know that Sonny would connect with much of anything. He had sound fundamentals, but a serious speed deficit. Marty Marshall was around 179 while Liston was around 206 for their trilogy. Marshall's win proved that Dempsey was more than big enough to drop Sonny, fracture his jaw and knock him out. Size and strength wasn't necessarily the refuge for Liston commonly supposed.

Now if this becomes a matter of who connects first, Sonny's most famous first round knockouts were actually anomalous in his career.

Johnny Summerlin was a tough guy able to stand up to Liston twice despite lacking Jack's footwork and upper body movement. Otherwise, he was also closer to Dempsey's size than Marshall was. Jack's low posture would provide a poor target for Sonny's body attack, and Patterson had fleeting success getting under Liston in their first bout. (I think Sonny also has a lot of trouble with Frazier's low profile, head movement, work rate and stamina. Liston didn't use his strength aggressively like Jeffries and Foreman.)

 

Dempsey was down ...and hurt ...and knocked out of the ring against Firpo in 1923. He came back to KO Firpo in what many have called the greatest fight ever!!! Liston quit sitting on his stool against the light hitting Cassius Clay in Miami...and of course...we all know what happened up in Maine in 1965. Prime Dempsey KO's the vastly overrated Liston!!!

 

Do you have a source that works for that quote?

 

So, because Dempsey was in a fight made exciting by him fighting down to the much lesser ability of his opponent you are picking him?

I can't even imagine the scenario where Firpo would floor Liston. The Firpo knockdown is a case study of Dempsey's wandering focus and ring discipline. He stands with left down, feet squared, back to the ropes, while Firpo swims with novice haymakers... and Dempsey gets caught. That is hardly a ringing endorsement in your argument.

 

Damn Bil Tate boxes really well in that video.
Look at his range control, and jabbing with the footwork.

And Dempsey throwing some really nasty looking punches.
Love that footage. I wish that guy would post more.