Heavyweights. Old timers vs modern.

I don't think we'll ever see boxing progressing in the same way as other sports. Because those other sports rely more on size and power for success, whereas boxing doesn't.

No new punches are going to come to fruition in boxing. No more rules are likely to be invented. Which means that in each era, you'll get great fighters and not so great fighters. I think boxing has reached it's highest ceiling. Although some great fighters may emerge who could be classed as ATG's, I honestly don't think waves and waves of future ATG's will come through in each weight class every few years. I don't think in 20 years, the top fighters of the day will be classed as the greatest fighters of all time. I think it will ebb and flow like in most eras. Sometimes the MW division will be sizzling with great talent like it was in the early 90's, and sometimes it won't be, just like today. I think there'll be continuous ups and downs across all weights.

There has been progression in HW boxing since the early years. In the 90's and 00's, we had great HW's with skill and size. Guys like Lennox and Vitali etc. But we have no one today to equal those guys. I love Tyson Fury, but he has still got question marks against him. And guys like Wilder and AJ haven't overly impressed me as yet.

Progress in the HW division is more noticeable, because there's less fighters as a whole, and it's rare that you get a SHW who's really gifted.

You've said that fighters can't change their bodies if they have to hit a certain weight. Yet they can move up or down depending on their physique and their circumstances. But how can a HW change his body that much? He can cut fat or add muscle, but he has to fight with his height and his reach just like any other guy does. At the end of the day, you could have a HW of perfect proportions. But he'd still have to master the art of boxing. Technique will always be more important than size.

I understand your point to a degree, and your opinions always interest me. But in my honest opinion, the best HW's of today, are really no better than the best HW's of the 90's.

 

Modern. Just too skilled and too strong.

 

Exactly. As much as that riles up a lot of people... it's the truth. And I have nothing but respect for the old timers

 

What specific eras and fighters are we debating?

 

Skilled, because you would not see a tall heavyweight fighting like Buddy Baer anymore.
Strong, because they now make past heavyweight look like skinny little boys.

 

For me Before Tyson, then Tyson and beyond.

 

For me before Tyson, then Tyson and beyond.

 

I think that before we go any further, we all need to agree upon a specific time period.

 

Has to be modern 100%

And solely down to advancing PEDs , nutrition and sports science.

They prob lack the grit of old but jabs of bull tren in your aris EOD cancel everything else out

 

I would also say increase in the amount of countries able to compete in heavyweight boxing. It has went from an American sport, to a global sport. Heavyweights have just kept getting taller and taller.

 

Not really. Divisions fluctuate from good to bad. HW was good in the 90's. Poor in the 00's. Now slightly better again.
The tallest guys from this 'modern Klitschko era' were-
Vitali, Valeuv and Wlad.

Vitali lost to 90's era Lewis who was already on the way out. Out of his prime and out of his era.

Wlad was blitzed Corrie Sanders - a failed contender from the 90's era.

Valuev won a robbery against 46 year old Holyfield who was two decades removed from his own era.

Thats just 3 men. What other global HWs prove this era is the best era of all time?

 

So its just the HW division then? Does the same apply to all the lower divisions?

 

We disagree on those points then.

Pre-prime Vitali outclassed a near prime Lewis with only two weeks notice. Then Lewis declined the rematch.

Yes Wladimir lost to Sanders, but had not developed the skills he had later in his career, and went on to beat far better opponents than Sanders, against Peter, Byrd, Haye, Povetkin and Pulev.

Valuev was nothing special but did retired with a impressive 50-2 record, part of that reason was avoiding tough fights though.

 

Lewis was the champ. Vitali was the challenger. Vitali had been preparing his whole career for Lewis. Thats what challengers do.
It was Lewis who took the fight on two weeks notice after the Johnson fight fell through and was visibly out of condition , slow and sloppy.
I see you have to lie about matters to get ahead in the argument as nobody would claim Vitali outclassed Lewis. And Lewis did not outclass Vitali either. It was a dog fight in which Lewis prevailed due to his superior inside boxing skills.

That's beside the point. What other 'global' HWs make this modern era the best era? I don't see how 2 Klitschko's define 100 years of HW boxing.

 

Well he did outclass Lewis 4 rounds to 2 with only two weeks notice. Lewis did pull out of the rematch. No lying there I'm afraid.