[Video] Laszlo Papp - 3x Olympic Gold Medalist

Papp retired undefeated in the pros and was a monster amateur, three olympic golds, the last one in a final against the future lightheavyweight world champion, Jose Torres, he also was a great puncher in the amateur ranks with a 55 first round knockouts, a record of 301-12-6.
With a record of 13-0 with 6 ko's in the olympics.
As a pro, the politics affected his career more than his talent, he was little old when he turned pro and he seemed to lack the killer instinct, but i thought he could have beaten Giardello.

 

I dont think Papp could have done much more in the pros. He was nearing 40 when he was forced to quit and that was at a time when your late 30s was well over the hill. He also had bad hands and while he retired undefeated his record was pretty lackluster. The best names he fought as a pro were well past their primes and he didnt always look good against them. Tiger Jones was 34 and fighting his last fight, Randy Sandy had won 5 of his last 23 fights, Charlie Cotton was 35 and had won something like 5 of his last 30 fights and was also fighting his last fight against Papp, Peter Mueller had seen his best days, was 34 and was coming off a KO loss to guy with 10 fights under his belt when he first lost to Papp. Its true Mueller had beaten Giardello the year before in Germany but when you realise Giardello had iced Mueller in two rounds several years earlier and then read how Giardello was treated in the lead up to the fight (The Germans booked him in a bad hotel forcing him and his wife to look for other accommodations, they turned the heat off in the gym he trained at and it was winter, and prevented him from being able to use quality sparring partners) its not hard to see how he. Papp padded out his record with three stoppage wins over Mueller. Christensen was 36 and hadnt beaten a world class fighter in 8 years, that was Billy Graham in one of his last fights and Graham never won another fight and retired less than a year later. I just dont see anything particularly encouraging about Papps chances at the top. In 65 Giardello was fading fast but so was Papp and Giardello had been proven at a much higher level professionally than Papp had. He was long in the tooth like the best guys Papp fought but in reality he had beaten the best names Papp fought when those guys were actually in their primes. So while Giardello was faded he was fading from a much higher level than the faded journeymen Papp had feasted on. I think at best its a 50/50 proposition that Papp beats Giardello and unless hes carefully matched I dont see him successfully defending the title. Tiger, Archer, Benvenuti, Griffith, Mazzinghi, and Rodriguez all would have beaten him in one way or another. A guy like Freddie Little who was operating around the periphery in 1965 and trying to get big fights would have beaten Papp IMO. Even Giardello could take a decision over him in a rematch if he elected to take it. I think Papp should be remembered for being one of the greatest amateurs in history but his pro record is lackluster and any hope of him being a great pro champion is wishful thinking at best given his age, wear and tear, and the young guys coming up.

 

Good post Papp is a bit overated by some and a lot overated by Ras Al Ghoul or WETF his name is.

 

The only time I ever saw Papp in action was on TV sometime in the early sixties I think, when he gave George Aldridge a bit of a sustained beating over 15 rounds.
Aldridge was nothing special though.

 

I seen your videos, I just want to thank you for making these great videos of some of the old time fighters you bring attention to these atgs
your midget wolgast, Eduardo lausse, joe brown and many others fighters I barley heard of but because of your hard work I can finally see these awesome fighter in video
thank you

 

This content is protected

Found this on You Tube of Papp suffering a rare defeat and stoppage.
This is pretty brutal stuff when compared to the Amateur game now!

 

Don't forget that Pietryoski, the guy that stopped Papp, went to win a silver medal in the 1960 olympics, losing against Muhammad Ali and that he also won a medal in the previous games i believe.

 

Underrated how? What was his best professional win? Was it Leahy who had won two of his last five and would lost his next three, retiring onlly 5 months after Papp? Christensen who as I said earlier hadnt beaten a world class fighter in 8 years (and frankly I dont even count that version of Billy Graham as world class anyway but Ill throw you a bone...) when they first fought and 10 when they had their rematch? Harry Scott who finished his career with a 39-34-6 record? Folledo whose sole world class victory was one win in two fights over fringe contender Sugar Boy Nando? Sandy who had won only four of his last 23 fights? Cotton who had won five of his last 28? Tiger Jones who had won just 8 of his last 24 fights? Where are all of these big wins that illustrate he was underrated? He even struggled with some of those guys I listed above. How exactly is it underrating him to say he likely wouldnt have done much more than what he did? He had bad hands, was pushing 40, and was already showing his age in the ring against limited fighters he fought. He MIGHT have beaten Giardello, who was equally old and ringworn, but thats a big maybe because Giardello was on a whole different level than anyone Papp fought. BUT had he beaten Giardello I seriously doubt he lasts long unless he takes his title back to Europe and defends against the same type of stiffs he fought on the way up. If he does that its not to his credit. If he doesnt he loses to several of the younger guys on their way up. Regardless, as a professional and as a contender the guy is overrated. As an amateur his accomplishments should not be disputed.

 

It's a point of view.I like Papp, I just don't see this ATG that you do and his record definitely does not support such an elevated status.
No need for me to elaborate further, Klompton has already annihilated you.

 

Mullers only top win was the close win he got over Giardello in his backyard after the Germans treated Giardello like **** there. We saw how good Mueller actually was when he didnt have the Germans stacking the deck for him. Giardello knocked him out, literally three times in two rounds.

You can tout Christensens "win" over McCormick all you want but that "win" came after he was losing the fight on points, had been knocked down and was unable to continue when the ref let him rise and then remarkably disqualified McCormick for having the temerity to finish Christensen off. Cheeky Danes. So no, Christensen doesnt impress me one bit as an opponent. He was not worldclass. Certainly not when he lost to Papp.

Its also laughable to laud Spider Webb as a top 100 middleweight when he was a 21 year old amateur which was a damn sight different than fighting a 26 year old soviet who was having his living and training subsidized by his government and who had 7 years of experience including an Olympic title. Get real. Thats the problem with rating these long standing soviet amateurs. They werent really amateurs. They were essentially grown professionals fighting young boys with little experience. Its a joke and its an even bigger joke to pretend someone like a 21 year old Webb was as accomplished and skilled at that point in his career as he would be 6 years later when he became a solid professional. You match the 1958 version of Webb with Papp and he kicks Papps ass. Same with Torres who was only 20 when he fought Papp as an amateur. Wind the clock forward to 1964 or 1965 and Id pick Torres to stop Papp just like Pietrzykowski did.

And yes, Tiger Jones beat Robinson in 55 but that was 7 years before he fought Papp, he split two fights with a totally shot Gavilan four years before he fought Papp, and yes he also managed to win one of three fights against Giardello but that took place 3 years earlier, the victory you touted against Dwayne Horseman came against a total nobody who never in his life defeated a worldclass fighter. It was Horsemans first step up and only the second time in his career he went 10 rounds, he got a draw the first time he went ten rounds to the legendary Ernie Smith... By the time Papp got ahold of Tiger Tiger was done. You are aware of the concept that fighters age correct? They dont just begin in the perfectly formed state at which they hit their peak and then stay there from their first amateur fight to their final pro fight. There is a bell curve there. If you arent aware of that fact it would explain why you are so impressed with Papp beating guys in their final fight who were losing far more than winning at the point he fought them.

But youve answered my question and proven my argument better I could have. The fact that you have to scrape together decades past wins over young amateurs and try to qualify his weak opposition based on their tattered records says enough about Papp's level of competition as pro. The guy had a signed title fight in an era when those things dont come cheap and he did it by fighting some of the weakest opposition you can imagine. Pretty remarkable. Id say overrated is about the best description of Papp as a pro.

 

Anyone else would slink away after being destroyed like this,but Rasta doesn't suffer from embarrassment or humiliation,perhaps he has gotten inured to it over the years?

 

Yeah you're the boss here RastaGhoul!

 

Who gives two shits whether Muller was a cult figure. Nobody cares that his most famous accomplishment in the ring was attacking a defenseless referee. I also dont give two shits if you think the German judges didnt benefit him in his fight with Giardello. I already explained what the Germans did to Giardello to give Muller an advantage i.e. booking him deplorable conditions, forcing him to train in an unheated gym in the winter, and preventing him quality sparring. Like I said. We saw what happened when they fought without Giardello being handicapped. What the **** does Scholz have to do with anything? Nobody even mentioned him.

I dont care if Christensen was younger than Papp. He was still garbage when they fought and his age doesnt change the fact that he had not beaten a world class fighter in ten years and thats IF you consider the Billy Graham that he beat a worldclass fighter when hes coming off an apendectomy and would never win another fight.

As if Hungary wasnt a soviet puppet state at the time in question...

I dont even have the faintest idea what you are trying to say here. If you are going to argue for these shitty European bums you love so much on an english speaking forum then by god learn the ****ing language so we can understand your asinine comments.

Webb fought and defeated MUCH more impressive competition as a professional than Papp did. Compare their records. We arent talking about a grown man being supported by his government to fight amateur boys. We are talking a real pro fighting real pros and Webb has a hell of a better record than Papp does in the pros. Furthermore, Papp was never rated the number 1 contender. The highest rating he attained was #4 (and had gotten there without fighting a single contender). Sorry to burst your bubble and no, its doubtful he would have been made a favorite over Giardello. An unproven #4 contender who was pushing 40, had bad hands, and had been struggling with his soft competition at times would not be favored over a sitting champion. You need to go read up on how odds are made. As for Torres he only moved up to LHW in 1965 because he couldnt get a shot at the title. In 1964 he was still fighting as a middleweight and given that he had actually fought and beaten some contenders at that point (unlike Papp) Id favor Torres.

Are you ****ing shitting me? Youre still trying to use Jones two fights against a shot Gavilan, one of which he lost, FOUR YEARS EARLIER, as proof that Jones was still somehow a good fighter in in 1962 in his last fight??? And since you are such a nazi about the spelling of a fighters name: WHO THE **** IS CAVALIN???

You think because Tiger Jones won one fight out of three against Giardello three years earlier that this gives us any idea how Papp would have done against Giardello? Or that this means Papp actually fought a good, prime contender? No. It does not.

Of course its unimportant to you. You have blinders on. Its also unimportant to you that Papp never beat a contender. Never beat a worldclass fighter. Never achieved a #1 ranking. Never earned a title shot. None of this is important when you think Papp wheres a red cape and has a big yellow "S" on his chest. Real facts dont matter.

Oh I see, so its ok to get knocked out as long as its in an unimportant fight... You seem full of excuses... excuses or excrement, Im not sure which.

LOL. Robbed. HA! The guy had one decent round that might have been even before Ali took over and totally outboxed him and thats a robbery? Let me guess, he was unpopular with the judges. The end of his career??? He fought on for another 5 years. He was literally right in the middle of his career. Wait, so let me get this straight: By your backwards logic guys fighting their last fight on a massive losing streak are still viable contenders as good as they ever were but a 25 year old guys right in the middle of his amateur career with five more years left, several major competition medals and an olympics still to go is somehow at the end of the line? Jesus do you hear how many excuses youve had to come up with to paint your heroes as something they werent?

If you go back and actually read my posts you will see I gave him full credit for his amateur achievements. What you seem unable to comprehend is that there is a huge huge difference in being a great amateur and being a great professional. Plenty of great amateurs enter the pros and amount to nothing. Papp beating a bunch of has beens and never weres does not impress me. Why should I pretend that a guy who was fighting a bunch of kids as a grown man over three and four rounds is every bit as good a fighter as a grown man who is regularly fighting 10 and 15 rounds against tough proven professionals. Sorry, it doesnt work like that. If Papp wanted to actually be recognized as a great PROFESSIONAL boxer then he should have actually stepped up the competition before he was forced to retire.

That was Papps choice. He didnt have to linger in the amateurs for 12 years. He could have easily turned pro and tested his mettle against real fighters but the fact is that it was a huge advantage for him to stay in the amateurs for over a decade gaining all of that experience and fighting a bunch of young, up and coming guys. Thats why the Eastern European amateur boxing program has always been skewed and given an unrealistic picture of those fighters talents. Do you really want to pretend that a 20 year old kid with 3 years of experience isnt at a disadvantage against 26 year old man with 10 years of experience? So dont cry me a river about Papp turning pro late.

 

So which was it, he didnt have any intention of fighting for a world title or he wasnt allowed to? There is an inconsistency in your argument there. Dont tell me that a guy who signed for a world title fight after one of the easiest pre title runs of that era had no interest in fighting for a world title. But you are right about one thing. When you compare his approach to the circus. It wasnt about a real competitive fight, it was a burlesque. Thats why he wasnt really challenging top fighters. He was there to cash in with the most reward and least risk. Thats fine but when you of all people realise that dont come here and pretend his pro career was anything impressive.

You are talking apples and oranges comparing today, where there are numerous championships and nobody fights anybody. Back then it wasnt like that. You should stick to your Euro trash boxing and stop trying to make a case for protected guys like Papp, Muller, etc. He hadnt EARNED a shot. Title shots are earned by fighting contenders and he hadnt fought a single contender. He was rated #4 and the three guys ahead of him would have all beaten him and most of the guys below him would have as well and even some who werent rated or were rated in other divisions. That isnt EARNING your shot its the exact opposite. In fact the fact that Giardello even selected Papp shows you that he thought Papp was a soft touch because at that advanced age Giardello wasnt looking to risk his championship if he didnt have to. Thats why he selected Rubin Carter, his #2 instead of the stylistic more challenging Archer who was his actual #1 (not Papp, sorry to burst your bubble again). The fact that Giardello was actively looking down the rankings for guys he would match up well with tells you all you need to know about his thoughts on Papp.