Prime liston vs prime holmes. Who would back sonny?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Fergy, Feb 25, 2017.

  1. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    It's not wrong to back Sonny but Larry is the more logical pick. Holmes was one of the few guys who's jab either rivaled or was superior to Liston's. in addition he had great footwork, strong recuperative powers and some size to work with as well. One of the reasons why Liston lost so badly to Muhammad Ali was because he had never before dealt with that type of fighter... Larry Holmes was cut from a similar cloth.
     
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  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Truth be told, I can't remember. It was from an article posted here about ten years ago by a guy called Zivic57, I think. Old guy. It's horrible but he's probably dead now. ****, really, that all the info posted here isn't collated. I'd doubt you could even search for it given the big crash of 08.
     
  3. GordonGarner65

    GordonGarner65 Active Member Full Member

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    I always struggle with Liston. When was his peak and defining wins? By the time he fought Ali he was aged and had been inactive . He had 2 blowouts v Patterson over the previous 2 and a half years and nothing else.
    Earlier wins over Folley , Williams etc are probably where his peak lay.
    Films ive seen make him look like a straightforward one two, jab right hand fighter.
    Its a guess, but i think Holmes has a bit more scope and brings a few more skills to the ring.
     
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  4. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    Yes I think that's the main problem with liston in that we don't really have much on him regarding his peak years. Obviously on his way to the title he was good enough to be avoided by some. I think for that to be the case he must have had something going on for him to be avoided. And of course no one else ko d Patterson in one round, so to be that good at that age I believe, he must have been pretty good in his prime
     
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  5. Hannibal Barca

    Hannibal Barca Active Member Full Member

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    Holmes mobility, size, fast stinging jab, and ridiculous recuperative powers are just about everything you would want in a heavyweight to beat Liston. I'd make Larry a slight favorite here, something like +130. I think if Larry's jab keeps the fight at long range then its hard to see Sonny win a decision. Sonny would have to take a seek and destroy approach and take the fight to the trenches or least mid range.
     
  6. GordonGarner65

    GordonGarner65 Active Member Full Member

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    Agree, i also think Patterson teaches us nothing about Liston. Floyd was simply in over his head mentally against Liston.
     
  7. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    He was. Poor Floyd had no confidence facing sonny. U can't go in to the ring with that level of self doubt against a guy like liston. He would be like a shark smelling blood.
     
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  8. cuchulain

    cuchulain Loyal Member Full Member

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    Possible, but I don't think so.

    I rank Larry higher (very slightly ) as an ATG, but h2h, I see Liston as the winner here.

    Larry had very decent recuperative powers, but Liston had more than decent finishing skills.

    At some point, I see Liston hurting Holmes and its down hill from there.
     
  9. BCS8

    BCS8 VIP Member

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    I'd have to pick Holmes by points. He's just the more solid fighter record wise, has THAT jab and a bit of a size advantage. I guess Liston could try and turn up the heat to KO him, but if I had to put money down, Larry's where it would be at.
     
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  10. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    I would back Liston at his best but, and there is a but-

    If they shared the same era, we would be much more likely to get a good version of Holmes on the day.

    This might skew the odds in favour of Holmes in a real world scenario.
     
  11. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    liston is overrated like hell but in this case stylistically he would ko holmes, liston was better than spoon in every single department and holmes lost this fight, larry would trade with liston and he would get knocked the **** out, holmes got dropped or seriously hurt many times, against shavers, snipes,weaver,spoon ..
    Liston would finish him, Holmes was not and never will be like Cassius clay
     
  12. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    Liston overrated like hell but would ko Holmes, seems to almost contradict itself tho i might back Liston by a hair personally. Stating with surety he would KO Holmes is a pretty big call. It's entirely possible he would, but also entirely possible he wouldn't. It's a tight fight.

    P.S. Witherspoon didn't beat Holmes as much as i would have liked him to at that time.
     
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  13. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    And as I said there's nothing wrong with that answer.
     
  14. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    Definitely, liston could bang we know that for a fact. And Holmes could be dropped and hurt. Yes he had good recovery but how much would liston shake him. And when Larry gets hurt he fires back. Against sonny that could be a bad idea..
     
  15. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    well.. i disagree in everything...liston is overrated yes, but here he has stylistical advantage.
    And yes, to me spoon looked the winner and aggresor against holmes