Ali H2H

Obviously it is very hard to be sure how big the global talent pool is at a given time, but there are significant clues.

While there are no records of the majority of fights in the 1930s for example, we do have a good idea of the number of boxing gyms, and the number of boxing cards in inner city areas.

This data suggest that the talent pool in the USA peaked in the depression era, declined during the war, and declined significantly in the post war era.

Before the advent of television, people used to entertain themselves by watching boxing matches, and some cities seem to have practically had a gym on every city block!

Boxing was also the only route out of poverty for people in low socioeconomic classes.

This lead to a vast talent pool!

 

We don't know when steroid use began, because people rarely admit using them, but the practice of bulking up significantly starts with Michael Spinks.

I am just saying that the people who grew up watching Dempsey, Louis, and Ali, went on to see them as the GOAT, and the same thing hasn’t quite happened with the people who grew up watching Bowe, Lewis et al.

Perhaps because they were not quite as dominant in their respective eras.

 

I have presented my evidence.

If you have any evidence to the contrary, please present it.

 

In Prices defense he really should have won that fight ,the guy is both poorly managed and has little boxing IQ in the ring. the first knock down and he didnt really know how to maintain control. Price can fight and punch but his problem seems mental and panicks to try and win the fight quick and when it doesnt happen he loses confidence and seems his chin isnt very sturdy at all but stamina seems to be also an issue.

Lee would lose many fights today,theres just better well trained fighters doing that type of training but these are elite talents not guys off the street learniong self defense which was his era that he himself was predicting would be the way to train in the future and that's a fighting system, Jeet Kwon Do ( not art) that included all fighting styles.

I myself predicted even as a kid that ( Shoot fighting, a hybrid /boxing/kick boxing/submission grappling fighting system) back in the late 80's would be the fight system of the future on T.V and people laughed now look UFC emerged soon after .....we now have MMA as a sanctioned sport .

 

The only thing you presented was a whacko statement...thats not even an opinion saying boxing peaked in the late 20's ....thats some Dago Wop shyte right there...lol....no thanx i'll pass!

 

No I referenced an academic study, about the number of active boxing gyms, and boxing cards in inner city areas, in the past relative to the 1990s.

Boxing Illustrated March 1996

All that you have done is asserted something without evidence!

 

I didnt know common sense needed any type of evidence? there is a FAR larger number of boxers today due to population and international competition....its simply idiotic to go on further here and adding talent and better trained athletes today!

 

I have provided my evidence, and acknowledged its limitations.

You are just putting your fingers in your ears, and saying "la la la I'm not listening".

 

'no very knowledge boxing fan would question the greatness of Jack Johnson or Joe Louis."

Thats funny bc in the very video below Monte Coxx the most notable boxing historian writer says this.....

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Thats bc only a crazy person is listening to such a CRAZY point!

 

I think that the global talent pool has always depended primarily on one or a small number of countries, with very deep boxing traditions.

America was the main powerhouse in both the 1990s and the 1920s.

Boxing has always been a truly global sport, but breaking the American market has become a lot less important since the 20s.

The effect of the end of Communism on the talent pool is hard to judge, but the fact that the UK is a major power today, suggests to me that the global talent pool is not the biggest that it has ever been.

Either way, it is important to emphasise that the GOAT would not necessarily emerge from the country, or the era with the biggest talent pool.

He might just pop up in Luxembourg.

 

The number of more boxers always indicates better competition....but when you add in actual skill sets thats another story ....no true realist is going to look at the 1920's and think they were better. theres also 9 more weight divisions compared to the 20's which its stupid to argue that today not only there are more competitors but the actual TALENT is by far better.
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All sports grow and advance in any category through population,MOST sports also advance thru combination of things ,history/Video/resources etc.. availabilty of ones opponent/better access to modern diet/more focus on the specific sport/better fundamentals of sports science/ In almost any Olympic even as well records are being broken almost always.


The HW divison? Well put Carnera or Baer against almost almost any shw today and they lose easily.


Put SRR against RJJ and I don't think its a question RJJ would win that one.



Put Lewis/Klitcko against ali and theres no way I favor Ali.



Cruiser Holyfield > Joe Louis

Of course these are my examples and opinions but the reference can almost always be used when lining up similar fighters of different eras.



on the current era I would say the majority HW may not be as slick but they are no longer the same weights hence its a different weight class any which way you look at it when 19 of 20 top 20 boxers are over 220. And reality many 230 plus fighters move pretty good,fury is proof of that heres a 6'9 260 plus guy dancing around the ring with really good footwork. That would be unheard of in any other era.


One can argue the size vs skill but that doesn't take away the competitive modern SHW era now. You would also have to factor in the Cruiserweights with Hw's today bc that is the weight class it was then.

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So basically you are so entrenched in your position that you don't care about evidence anymore!