[GIF] Corbett slips and blocks a big 2 punch combo from Fitzsimmons (Stabalized)

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by reznick, Apr 8, 2017.


  1. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    This content is protected
     
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  2. FrankinDallas

    FrankinDallas FRANKINAUSTIN

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    Seriously...why did Corbett always wear those frankly gay ass shorts?
     
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  3. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    One thing apparent in watching Corbett is his excellent judge of distance. That comes from hours in the ring. And tho he didn't have a high number of fights (tho numbers do vary) he was a trainer for quite a long time.
     
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  4. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He doesn't slip it. He leans back without balance to counter. The "block" is more of a parry and too sloppy to counter from.
     
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  5. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Since Fitz holds both hands low, this is excellent opportunities for countering. Corbett's could roll or block the right and come back with his own. Perhaps he could even roll under and come back with his left.

    He has more or less the same options (but reverse) countering the left hook.

    I appreciate the gif, but if it's meant as an example of old timers refined technique...
     
  6. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    He also seemed more invested and proud of his amateur career, and had a somewhat snobbish attitude towards professional boxing. So yeah you're right, he had experience.
     
  7. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    Why would you block an overhand right?
    It's best to just get out of the way of those.

    And if he had countered the right, he would've gotten hit with the hook given his positioning.

    He can't check hook after the overhand because the step he takes backwards to avoid it uses up his balance.
     
  8. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He was in perfect position to block the right and shoot back his own right. That would have been very effective since Fitz overbalanced with his right, had his left low and his chin hanging freely. But he could also roll the right or toll under it. He if there hade come a left afterwards he could have treated it the same as long as he dealt with the first situation correctly.

    Both does more or less what you're taught not to do. Corbett's awareness in this clip is good, his technique isn't. Same for Fitz. To lead with a winging right, especially as exposed as he is, is very dangerous. He does the right thing to follow up with the left, since Corbett's defensive maneuver has left him unable to counter, but he's too exposed when throwing it.

    Imagine Fitz' right targeting Toney with that right... James would have popped him 10 times out of of 10.
     
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  9. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    https://media.giphy.com/media/WaILJGaWFZsYw/giphy.gif

    My poor attempt at a GIF :).

    But this is true boxing masterclass to me. Mike slips Toney's jab and counters with a left hook since James's right is low. Toney pulls his head back out of the way but still keeps his balance so he can shoot a right straight back over Mike's low left. It lands, but Mike rides with it and takes enough steam off to counter with his own right. Toney shoulder rolls that one and shoots another right, which Mike ducks under. After ducking Mike is still in position to throw his left hook, which he does right after this slow-mo ends.

    These two are also a bit sloppy with how they hold their hands, but they are ready to ride, roll or duck anything that comes in and almost always keep their balance to counter off of any defensive maneuver they make.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2017
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  10. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    That's a great gif! I love the exchange.

    The thing is, this wouldn't look good to I think you if the exact same thing were filmed in 1906.
    It would look like a sloppy exchange, because it's not aesthetically perfect.
    Everything has to look aesthetically perfect with antique cameras, or else is doesn't get widespread appreciation.

    Now, to compare it to Fitz-Corbett:
    Fitz is one of the best punchers of all time.
    Look at the perfect looping trajectory of the overhand right. And the weight and force of it. It looks like Marcianos punch.
    Fighting in the pocket with him would be a thrill seeking endeavor.
    Corbett had the stylistic matchup for him, staying on the outside, using his footwork, jab and range to stay away from his power punches.

    Fitz strung together a hook right on top of the overhand. If Corbett tried to counter by shooting out his right, he might've been toast. He needed to block, and move the opposite direction of that hook just to avoid it. Maybe it could've worked. But seems like an unnecessary risk, when Corbett could lay his attack in less dangerous circumstances.

    Also, I never use one fighters stylistic tendencies as a standard for what is good. Every fighter has their own style that lends itself uniquely to different situations. I would love to see Fitz vs. Toney though!
     
  11. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Standard practice in boxing is that you should always be able to counter off of any defensive maneuver. It's not easy but the standard. Corbett's balance and moves are too poor for him counter. I think Fitz offense is signalled and open, so there's plenty of opportunity.

    If he shoots back a straight right counter, either after blocking or rolling, it will reach Fitz before Fitz hook reaches him. Seeing how roundhouse the right is, Corbet would perhaps be better off rolling under it and coming back with a left hook. Either way he beats Fitz to the punch. And if his left is up, as it should be, he he's covered anyhow.

    They both look poor in this clip. Has nothing to with the quality of the film. Just their relative lack of balance and form.

    This is so patently obvious to me that I'm always puzzled by these discussions.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2017
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  12. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    Yeah ideally. But you can't always counter off a defensive maneuver.
    Tyson and Ali don't always return something when slipping and dodging.
    That's normal in boxing. You can't interrupt every combo your opponent throws at you.

    Do you not see the speed of Fitzsimmons hook?
    You can't get a punch in there after stepping back and slipping the overhand.
    Fitz hook is already launched before Corbetts front foot is planted.
    It's impressive enough that he was able to evade the hook.

    They definitely do not look poor.
    Fitz punching technique is incredible. (You say his overhand should be blocked, when in reality that punch would rip through a guard and KO Corbett.)
    Corbetts smooth close quarters defense looks really good.

    And how is anything lacking with their balance?
    Their balance is perfect. They're carrying their weight exactly the way they should be.
     
  13. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Og course Corbett could block that punch without being hurt, much less KO'd. Fitz is overbalanced and takes a half step forward. It's a poor winging punch.

    This discussion is a bit unreal to me. You box, surely your trainers wouldn't let you get away with doing the things they are doing in this clip? No guard, chin high, leaning back with poor balance, parrying by shooting both hands in front of you? These few second are riddled with "don'ts".

    And, yes, you can find sections with "don'ts" in Toney-McCallum as well. But those wouldn't be used as examples of top technique.

    A trainer that uses this clip to say to his students "this is how you should do it" shouldn't be a trainer. For me the technical flaws jump off the screen. This is what I have to say about this.
     
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  14. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    Speak of surreal. A winging punch? Dude that's an overhand right from hell.
    See how the Instagram clip has a thumbnail frame? You can see his right arms hanging low from the trajectory of the heavy devastating right. It's like this: https://streamable.com/tso3
    Corbett isn't blocking that with a glove in front of his face.

    A lot of fighters in my gym fight guarding the body and moving their head, just like Corbett is doing.
    All different kinds of styles emerge from our gym, no two people have the same. And our coach mixes in common technique with unique advice to specific people depending on their styles.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2017
  15. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Wow....does anyone realize what Rez just found and showed all of us? In my lifetime the first time the Fitzsimmons "shift" was shown by the master himself. Note the right swing, the quick shift to southpaw stance and followed by the killer left hook....this time to the head.

    Everyone should watch that clip again and again. It's probably the most important film clip ever shown on these boards. True boxing history no longer lost in time.
     
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