Chocolatito is still the best, and HBO's hit job on him can't change that.

I thought he won too , but i don't know if he was the p4p number 1 , i don't follow the flyweight classes as much
as the higher , if he was number 1 p4p before that fight , he has to be still the number 1.
I didn't see that much of his career, i follow the weight classes from 126 pounds to 200+ pounds.

 

This I agree.
If Choco is really P4P 1 then he would have disposed off Srisaket and Cuadres without problems.
In fact in my scorecards, the Thai guy scoring a KD plus the flat footed Choco chasing him all around actually lost. Choco was outboxed. No robbery here.
In a rematch, I would still pick Srisaket via UD.
Choco threw all his best punches without scoring a KD or seriously hurting the Thai guy. Can't hurt him, can't beat him. Full stop.

 

Estrada, Viloria, Yaegashi were all top level wins. But he did miss out on some names.

 

Arguments for Chocolatito being P4P no.1:
- He may have 'officially' lost to Rungvisai but in the opinion of most, that was a Roman victory
- Ward, Kovalev, Golovkin all arguably lost their fights.
- Roman is coming off an amazing streak, enough to establish him as a legit ATG and one of the greatest Flyweights in history. A robbery loss to Rungvisai shouldn't change this impact.
- He had a close fight with Rungvisai and Cuadras, both who are clearly top operators, and he did beat Cuadras in the opinion of the vast majority. These aren't B graders, these are legit A grade boxers.
- Roman is beating A grade operators in a weight class he doesn't really have business being in.


Arguments against Chocolatito being P4P no.1:
- Choco at Super Flyweight + at this stage of his career, clearly isn't the same fighter as he used to be. There are a number of fighters who are better than what Choco is at S.Flyw. Inoue would be favoured in a match between the two at 115 and they're both at the same weight.

- Choco arguably lost to both Cuadras and Rungvisai, and has an official loss to Rungvisai.

- Ward arguably beat AND has an official win over Kovalev, an absolute monster. Kovalev is pretty much Inoue level, forget Rungvisai/Cuadras.

Whatever tickles the balls. I'd keep Roman as my P4P number 1 even though he isn't as good but he is seriously about to drop after Ward-Kovalev 2, UNLESS he fights and beats Inoue.

 

Yes I'm serious.

 

There's no real argument against Gonzalez, but there are real arguments in favour of others imo.

 

I got 1 minute into that video...it was like Charlie Zelanoff all over again. I had Choc winning and am hoping he can bounce back. I appreciate his talent and try to stay away from the p4p debate (it's too hard with so many great boxers right now).

 

None of them are in their fourth weight class. Pacquiao, Donaire, and Gonzalez are the only active fighters to do that trick. If Roberto Duran is having difficult fights with middleweights, and nobody has moved up more than one division but they are dominating, then he's still p4p#1. That is the actual definition of pound for pound. Who can give away the most size and weight to their opponents and still win.

 

In their second weight class, sure.

 

Well we have different definitions of pound for pound. I'm not saying Gonzalez isn't a top 10 guy. Do I think he would beat Ward, Kovalev, Lomachenko, Rigs etc, of they were the same mass, definitely not.

 

I agree. Ward won a controversial decision MOST thought he lost, Chocolatito lost a controversial decision MOST thought he won.

 

I had Ward winning but not clearly enough to supersede Chocolatito. All things being equal, let's say, the spots don't change.

 

Viloria wasn't a top level win. That was a past it shopworn Viloria that he beat. Against his two best opponents, Cuadras, and Estrada, it can be argued that he shouldn't have gotten the decisions.

 

Actually Srisaket showed up on the map in a big way with his title win over Sato (who I had scored his title winning effort against Suriyan Rungvisai to Suriyan). I watched both those fights live. I remember multiple times naming Srisaket vs. Suriyan as one of the fights I most wanted to see in boxing for a time... Then Srisaket lost to Cuadras, who became the #1 in the division, in a competitive technical decision, headbutting and losing a point along the way. His only loss since his fifth career fight was that one. He has 39 KO's in 43 wins. Ranked former champ that people who know 115 have definitely seen before and know. Not saying he's some epic great fighter but your whole first 3/4 of that post is just wrong.