41 year old Wlad in a series of fantasy fights

Complete nonsense, AJ dominated his first 18 opponents, he was levels above them and Wlad gave him a
good fight, so either you are trying to compare Trevor Berbick with AJ, which is a ridiculous comparison or
you are trying to compare Wladimir Klitschko with Eric Molina, which is an even worse comparison.

So you think it is time to retire for Wlad because he has lost to AJ as if it was a shame to lose to Anthony Joshua.
Muhammad Ali was levels above Trevor Berbick in his prime so it was time to retire for him when he lost against
him, but Wlad was never a lot better than he is now, he would have always had a tough fight with AJ.

 

Fighters like Klitschko in modern day are at a different level of fitness and have a complete different understanding of the fight game. It's all about sports scientists, nutritionists, supplements, cardio and strength coaches, high altitude training, be interesting when compared to the training regimes of the fighters in The OP selection.

Ali had a good training regime, his was powerful, but still holds weaknesses compared to Klitschkos, but comparing fighters now to then, is a complete mystery especially when the difference in health and fitness has changed especially in boxing.

 

I believe Wlad was a lot better than he is now. He is 41.

 

So you think that Wladimir in his prime was better than Anthony Joshua to the same extent Muhammad Ali
in his prime was better than Trevor Berbick ?

 

This is a great point and why I insist we take away all of this for these discussions and ask how much is left without it. Then it is about skill and natural toughness.

 

No, it was an example I used. It not as far. It's closer to where Jim Corbet was to James Jeffries. That's a closer comparison to the Wlad and Joshua situation.

 

Yea I mean fighters now are at a level of fitness unlike no other time in history. Check out the Olympics the athletes are constantly breaking records, because the whole training side has changed.

Be great to see fighters from the past face their future counterparts. Hopefully one day a super time machine can be built, for the sole purpose to please the boxing fans.

 

I think Klitschko would beat everybody except, Ali and Louis.

 

This is fair enough, but what I'm saying, is that it would have been extremely unlikely he'd have fought Ali in the same manner/mindset that he fought Joshua.

We've seen how reluctant he was to let his hands go against Fury.

We've seen how reluctant he was to press Haye, even though he had him pressed against the ropes on numerous occasions.

Ali's movement would have made him hesitant.

He'd have fought him in an ultra cautious manner.

You've also got to take into account the realistic psychological edge that Ali would have held over him.

Yes, Wlad wasn't mentally weak on Saturday. But that is because Joshua was untested, he had question marks surrounding his chin, and he had question marks surrounding his stamina. He was also much easier to time and hit. Even though Joshua possess the power that Tyson and Ali doesn't/didn't and he's more dangerous, his style gave Wlad the opportunity to be aggressive.

Now in the build up to his fight with Tyson, he was uncharacteristically angry, and he swore that he'd rid Tyson from the HW division as he wasn't a good role model. He was fired up. He was motivated. He'd sparred and trained with Vitali. But when it came down to it, he was naturally cautious, he was severely troubled by the movement, and he couldn't change his tactics. In an interview in the weeks that followed, he admitted that he didn't know why he couldn't change tactics.

Now I am honestly a fan of his. But his biggest downfall has always been his lack of mental strength.

In a fantasy thread, we can give our opinion on what would have happened if Wlad had fought Ali in the EXACT SAME MINDSET/MANNER that he fought Joshua. But what I'm telling you, is that after watching him for over 20 years, he would never have fought the likes of Ali in that same manner. It's completely unrealistic.

What's the difference between the version of Wlad who fought in Dusseldorf, to the one who fought at Wembley?

It's the opponent that was different.

You're all entitled to your own opinions, and it makes for a great thread. But when you're talking about him knocking out prime versions of Louis etc at 41, I simply have to question why he couldn't take out the likes of Haye and Jennings etc when he was younger. I appreciate that styles make fights, but all throughout his career, Wlad has struggled and lost to lesser fighters.


Regarding your earlier comments, don't worry about it.

We can have a great debate without throwing around any insults.

Todd got under my skin in a few threads, but I regret my actions now, and I think we're cool.

 

He would have fought everyone in an ultra cautious manner in your opinion, even against Muhammad Ali
who had not quite the power you need to hurt him.

 

We know what George brought to the table.

Look closely at the careers of Wlad and Lennox.

George wasn't the most gifted, but he was strong and aggressive, and he'd have been a huge threat to them. To say he'd have had no chance is ignorant.

A peak version of Larry Holmes was also a great HW.

Regarding the guys you listed, I think they'd all had mixed results.

 

It's cool to disagree. However, if you think he'd have beaten all of those greats at 41, you simply have to question why the exact same guy couldn't beat/couldn't comprehensively beat, much lesser fighters, when he was younger.

 

You forget that all of the greats had bad fights and lost, they all lost to lesser fighters than Wlad as well.
If we are talking about hypothetical matchups, we have to talk about the best possible versions.

 

You obviously have zero knowledge of boxing history. Absolutely none.

 

Example?