The 7ft elephant in the ring...

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017.


Who wins? 6'6'', 250llbs Anthony Joshua vs 7'0'' 320llbs Nikolay Valuev?

  1. Joshua

  2. Valuev

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  1. Okin129

    Okin129 ... Full Member

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    Yes, because he does everything better than Valuev and has far more punching power despite the fact that
    Valuev is much bigger.

    I'm not saying that fighters from the past are worse than today but fighters like Muhammad Ali and Sonny Liston
    should be compared to cruiserweights and not to modern athletic super heavyweights.
     
    Okin129, May 9, 2017
    Okin129, May 9, 2017
    #16
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  2. DoubleJab666

    DoubleJab666 Dot, dot, dot... Full Member

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    So skills can negate physical advantages? Just to be clear, that's what you're arguing in the specific case of Joshua vs Valuev?
     
    DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017
    DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017
    #17
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  3. Okin129

    Okin129 ... Full Member

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    Of course they can but not in this case and not in the case that Muhammad Ali would win against AJ.

    Valuev is not an athletic guy, his extreme size is a disadvantage for him, he had not even great punching
    power and he was a champion despite the fact that he was only an average boxer, so his size worked for
    him to a certain degree but he couldn't compete at elite level.
     
    Okin129, May 9, 2017
    Okin129, May 9, 2017
    #18
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  4. Peppermint

    Peppermint Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Valuev was better than he got credit. he was a distance fighter, and was durable. And he never did lost badly. For a massive guy with two bad knees, he did alright for himself. I think Joshua beats him, but Valuev generally did well with bug guys. He couldn't handle movement, which Joshua doesn't really present.
     
    Peppermint, May 9, 2017
    Peppermint, May 9, 2017
    #19
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  5. DoubleJab666

    DoubleJab666 Dot, dot, dot... Full Member

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    So the principle has been accepted, good. Maybe then, when people argue in favour of Joshua vs Ali, Tyson etc the '6'5'', 240llbs argument will cohabit with an assessment of skill too. No one argues Ali is the same size as Joshua, they argue his skill-set would be enough to negate the physical disadvantages. There's a case to be made for this, although it's a tough ask to make it stick.

    I actually do agree Ali would struggle with skillful super heavyweights from the Lewis era onward. But that's based on more than simply size. That said, from things I've read, you do seem to take a wider, smarter view of era vs era match-ups. Some don't.

    #gravity
     
    DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017
    DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017
    #20
  6. DoubleJab666

    DoubleJab666 Dot, dot, dot... Full Member

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    Apparently, Valuev didn't want to be a boxer, he wanted to be a poet but because of his unusual size was forced to fight. And yeah I agree, he gets discredited because of how he looked rather than how he fought...
     
    DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017
    DoubleJab666, May 9, 2017
    #21
  7. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    valuev is a fighter of the past too.
     
    HerolGee, May 9, 2017
    HerolGee, May 9, 2017
    #22
  8. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    valuevs physical disadvantages in cardio will be key here, they are bigger than joshuas physical disadvantages.
     
    HerolGee, May 9, 2017
    HerolGee, May 9, 2017
    #23
  9. Okin129

    Okin129 ... Full Member

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    A guy like Dominic Breazeale for example would lose to Muhammad Ali, because his size couldn't negate the
    huge difference in skill level between him and Muhammad Ali.

    Size is not all that matters but it is a huge factor when both fighters are on elite level and Anthony Joshua is
    clearly an elite level super heavyweight, nothing to take away from Muhammad Ali, i'm a big fan and he was a
    great fighter in his era and he would probably rule the cruiserweight division today but in a matchup between
    him and Anthony Joshua, i would put Anthony Joshua as the favorite.
     
    Okin129, May 9, 2017
    Okin129, May 9, 2017
    #24
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  10. ForemanJab

    ForemanJab Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    SNV
     
    ForemanJab, May 9, 2017
    ForemanJab, May 9, 2017
    #25
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  11. KiwiMan

    KiwiMan Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This is a good explanation of your point of view, regardless of whether one agrees or not.
     
    KiwiMan, May 9, 2017
    KiwiMan, May 9, 2017
    #26
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  12. cippi

    cippi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    guys stop. aj beats the crap outta valuev
     
    cippi, May 9, 2017
    cippi, May 9, 2017
    #27
  13. ForemanJab

    ForemanJab Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    case closed
    This content is protected
     
    ForemanJab, May 9, 2017
    ForemanJab, May 9, 2017
    #28
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  14. OvidsExile

    OvidsExile At a minimum, a huckleberry over your persimmon.

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    This content is protected


    This content is protected
     
    OvidsExile, May 9, 2017
    OvidsExile, May 9, 2017
    #29
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  15. BlizzyBlizz

    BlizzyBlizz Loyal Member Full Member

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    Foh. Ali would whip Joshua's ass.
     
    BlizzyBlizz, May 9, 2017
    BlizzyBlizz, May 9, 2017
    #30
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