Better All-Around Fighter: Primo Carnera or Riddick Bowe?

Tunney saying Carnera had great conditioning does not indicate,or imply, he had any great talent, and Tunney is quite clear that in his opinion he did not.
He says ,he had a vulnerable chin, panicked when opponents breached his defences,had very limited technique,and could not punch.
That is as comprehensively damning an assessment of a fighter as you can get!
There is simply no way you can squirm ,and attempt to spin this into anything but a totally negative and disastrous opinion as to his talents.
I don't hope for anything I just read and absorb facts. If I honestly believed Carnera was a talented fighter I would say so ,why would I not?
You, Janitor, and Reznik have attempted to deny the undeniable,to explain away the unexplainable,and to do so you have accused the American media, world champions,and the rest of us, of having a bias against Super heavyweights and Italians.
None of the three of you have a trace of credibility with me anymore, now obviously that doesn't bother you in any way ,I'm just stating it for the record.

 

How stupid is this post?
Baer won the title on the 14th of June 1934.
Louis did not turn professional until the 4th of July 1934! One month later!
Louis did not enter the ratings,[ at number 9 ,] until the end of December 1934 !

 

Neusel fought Carnera in1935 , he had not been ranked since 1933 .

 

Neusel had not lost since he fought Max Schmeling in 1934, going into the bout with Carnera.

The bout with Schmeling (which many expected him to win), was the high point of his standing.

I would therefore suggest that he was a live contender when he fought Carnera.

Put it this way, I don't think that Neusel took the fight to pad Carnera's record.

 

With respect, I think that your post could be viewed as being a little bit stupid.

I did not anywhere say that this was said the day after Baer won the title.

Louis was obviously very much in the mix by the time of the Baer's first title defence fight.

Indeed his bout with Carnera drew twice as big a crowd as Baer's title defence against Braddock!

 

I think Tunney is being quite emphatic about him always having known that Carnera had "extremely limited fighting equipment."

The significance of Carnera being considered, by the same paper, as one of the best four Heavyweights since Tunney, doesn't change Tunney's opinion either. And, all this does is contradict views you have given earlier on what you think of the American press, of the times. It seems you're quite happy to cite them when it suits you.

And, what really is the significance of Carnera being considered one of the best Heavyweights since Tunney? Tunney had only been retired for 6 years, by the time the Carnera/Baer fight took place, during which time, Sharkey, Schmeling, Carnera and Baer had held the title of lineal champ. So, one would think it natural to have listed Carnera out of, if nothing else, common decency.

In respect to your comment: "I imagine if asked outright about Carneras worth as a champion, Tunney would have said something different." Unless you have source material, which indicates Tunney changed his opinion, this is pure speculation.

I cannot see what Primo might have done, post-Baer, to encourage Tunney to reconsider his position. Tunney couldn't have been clearer.

The Neusel fight is another case of you making a meal out of a relatively low-key bout. I do not understand why you keep focusing on it, as if it were some form of redemption for Carnera. It wasn't.

 

Why were Madison Square Garden’s hosting this relatively low key bout?

 

He was not a current contender which is how you described him.
Neusel had not lost since the Schmeling fight in which so badly was he outclassed that he quit,he had drawn with stylish, light hitting Len Harvey who was a light heavyweight and beaten another blown up light heavy Jack Peterson neither Harvey or Peterson were ranked at the time.Harvey was ranked as alight heavyweight in 1938 and 39.Peterson who was conceding lums of weight to Neusel was never ranked. You are trying to construct case for this being a big win for Carnera from smoke and mirrors and it won't pass.

 

Many of the reports I have read, place great emphasis on Carnera's conditioning and toughness. Some go further and mention his surprising agility.

None, that I have seen praise him for being a good technician, although very occasionally there is a reference, which implies Carnera could box, if he wanted to; normally, in an article, which is trying to fathom out why Carnera isn't better than his showings.

Carnera is an enigma to many. It seems clear to me that even the known boxers-turned-pundits of the time are being polite in the face of the enigma. And, Tunney, once his opportunity arose, immediately after the Baer debacle, unloaded with both barrels.

 

It was a significant win, because both of the them took the fight on the basis that it would put the winner back in the mix.

They were also both name fighters at the time.

 

He was not a current contender which is how you described him.
Neusel had not lost since the Schmeling fight in which so badly was he outclassed that he quit,he had drawn with stylish, light hitting Len Harvey who was a light heavyweight and beaten another blown up light heavy Jack Peterson neither Harvey or Peterson were ranked at the time.Harvey was ranked as alight heavyweight in 1938 and 39.Peterson who was conceding lums of weight to Neusel was never ranked. You are trying to construct case for this being a big win for Carnera from smoke and mirrors and it won't pass.

Less than 13,000 attended this fight, Carnera's previous fight had 60,000 in the crowd Yes it was definitely low key!

 

You have no gone from Neusel being," a current contender" to ," a name fighter".
Where will this end? "He was fairly well known in his home town." Perhaps?

 

His previous bout was with Joe Louis.

About 30 000 people attended Max Baers title defence against Jimmy Braddock.

I would say that half the crowd of a lineal heavyweight title defence, is a pretty darn high key bout for two contenders on the slide!

 

Neither of these statements is mutually exclusive.

 

You said," newly crowned champion ". Baer held the title one day short of a year .When do you now say he made this statement? You tried to make a feeble point which escaped me , and it came back to bite you in the a*se.