The thing about Keith Thurman. He's just Ok.

tinman · May 29, 2017

CST80 said: ↑

Spence didn't whoop anyone's ass for the first half of the fight, Kell won 4 arguably 5 of the first 6 rounds, and the 1 or 2 he lost were competitive, Spence was getting tagged and rocked often by Brook, his defense was porous and he ate a ton of flush shots. Fine he beat him down in the second half, but that was mainly due to Brook mentally checking out after sustaining yet another freak orbital bone fracture, and since he just went through it last year, and knowing the aftermath, it clearly made him hesitant to engage. But that's Boxing a punch caused the damage, and Spence won because of it, but had he not of cracked the bone, who knows how the match would have went.

No one is attacking you for being excited about 2 top young fighters being in the ring together, I'm attacking you for saying Thurman is just "Okay" you do realize you're laying the groundwork for others to denigrate Spence's victory over One Time should that result occur?
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Completely understand, but that's not why I made the thread. I never meant to jack up Brook or Thurman and claim they are/were great scalps for Spence. It's just that Thurman can't punch and he can't box, at least at the level he's hyped to be.

Brook is a good young fighter and Spence whooped his ass. To me that's good for the division because it's been in shambles for years now.

Thurman isn't a great talent so why would Spence's potential victory be a great victory? It's not groundwork to me. That's Thurman's level.

tinman · May 29, 2017

Bogotazo said: ↑

If your argument is that better welterweights have existed, then sure. But why is it a "problem"? Nobody is hyping him up as a potential ATG. He performed very well in his 2 biggest fights and will be tested in his 3rd against Spence. A lot of very good and great fighters in history don't have a crazy standout attribute.
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Teddy Atlas called Thurman the best athlete in the sport right now. I couldn't believe my brain when I heard that. Uhhh, Anthony Joshua, Russel Jr., Terrence Crawford??? Ring any bells Teddy?

Thurman is hyped.

tinman · May 29, 2017

CST80 said: ↑

Somehow I don't believe you, since I clearly rate Spence very highly, and thought Spence's victory, while slightly tainted by the eye injury and Brook draining himself to get back down to WW, was a great win, he has one of the best wins in the sport this year, certainly the best win at WW since May beat Pac, Thurman a close second with his official victory over Garcia, even though 2 arguably beat him to it. Yet I'm not going nearly as bat**** as you are about Spence, if the win wasn't that great, then why are you spazzing out all over the forum saying Spence beats Mayweather easily?

So what Thurman refers to himself in third person, he's a likable nice guy, I have nothing against him doing that, if he were a jerkoff to boot like Cotto, maybe I'd have more of an issue with it. And my God, how dare him, when he was younger he was KOing guys left and right, he like many other fighters believed in their power and hyped it, but when he took a step up in competition, he realized his power wasn't all that great, regardless, its still solid enough to keep guys with not good but GREAT beards honest like Garcia, Guerrero and Porter. Remind me again, who else has KO'd those 3?
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Because it was a no BS win. Stoppage victory. No delaying, no scheming, no blown up LW, no AARP member, no catchweight, etc. For once in the WW division one of the top guys decided to just fight.

theanatolian · May 29, 2017

The OP is a drama queen.

CST80 · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

Completely understand, but that's not why I made the thread. I never meant to jack up Brook or Thurman and claim they are/were great scalps for Spence. It's just that Thurman can't punch and he can't box, at least at the level he's hyped to be.

Brook is a good young fighter and Spence whooped his ass. To me that's good for the division because it's been in shambles for years now.

Thurman isn't a great talent so why would Spence's potential victory be a great victory? It's not groundwork to me. That's Thurman's level.
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Well you and I will have to agree to disagree, I think Thurman is a special talent.

CST80 · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

Because it was a no BS win. Stoppage victory. No delaying, no scheming, no blown up LW, no AARP member, no catchweight, etc. For once in the WW division one of the top guys decided to just fight.
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Well doesn't that apply to Thurman as well, since he has not one but two natural WW's on his ledger? And if you're like me 3, since I rate Chaves as well. Guerrero and Collazo while not elite anymore are both tough tests, and are both wins that easily equal a victory over Algieri and Bundu, if not surpass them.

theanatolian · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

Teddy Atlas called Thurman the best athlete in the sport right now. I couldn't believe my brain when I heard that. Uhhh, Anthony Joshua, Russel Jr., Terrence Crawford??? Ring any bells Teddy?

Thurman is hyped.
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He's hyped, but no more hyped than an undefeated, unified champion should be. Yeah, he doesn't have monster power, so what? When It wasn't enogh for him to win big fights, he found a different way to win and demonstrated variety to his game. That's something to be praised, not to be criticized.

And a 41 year old man looked to be the better natural athlete than AJ on spots, so to claim Thurman is a better athlete than him isn't outrageous.

JoffJoff · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

And before you say "Well Jesus Christ, stop holding him to a ridiculous standard like that" Well I'm not the ******* referring to myself in 3rd person as "One Time" and then get walked down by Robert Guerrero.
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I strongly disagree with the point your trying to make here as I rate Thurman highly and think he can both box and punch but credit where due, this was hilarious!

mafioso · May 29, 2017

i believe the swelling on thurman forhead from headbutt must have affected him but i agree thurman will never be A+ fighter he is A- maybe A

Ant Sutton · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

Thurman loves to refer to himself in 3rd person. And he loves to refer to himself as "One Time" as a description of his boxer-puncher style. But the problem is he's not a huge puncher and he's not a particularly skilled boxer either. He's just uninspiring for lack of a better word. Don't get me wrong he's not a bum and he's clearly one of the top Welterweights in the world. It's just that he's not as good as he's hyped. His power doesn't ding the best fighters. His stamina is completely average as is his aggression. I still remember when I saw him fight old, small Robert Guerrero. We all know Guerrero is tough as nails, but come on. RG was in his grill late in that fight taking it Thurman, I mean actually busting him up. Little Guerrero. You would expect any Welterweight who calls themselves "one time" to destroy a guy like Guerrero when Robert was just walking in like that. After that I knew the hype was more than the talent and power.

In my opinion despite the popularity of 147 in recent years the division has been meh since the Margarito, Williams, Cotto days. Even Kell Brook is in the same boat was Thurman. Good fighter, but nothing they do jumps off the TV screen.

Spence is the first young, natural Welterweight to come on the scene since Cotto, Margarito and Williams. I mean Floyd went his entire career without fighting a big, young hungry Welterweight. And Pac only did it once. Hoping that Spence whoops Thurman's ass and starts bringing back real Welterweight fighting again.
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Interesting points...how would you compare Thurman to Trinidad?

Farmboxer · May 29, 2017

Thurman will knock Spence out. Tito would have knocked Spence out, no contest................Spence is not as good as some claim, he is not the greatest welterweight in boxing history period.............

Ant Sutton · May 29, 2017

Farmboxer said: ↑

Thurman will knock Spence out. Tito would have knocked Spence out, no contest................Spence is not as good as some claim, he is not the greatest welterweight in boxing history period.............
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There's no way Spence is the best ever welterweight! I don't think anyone said that...but I would take him over Thurman.

PH|LLA · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

Forgot that he's undefeated which means everything today. All you need is the 0 today.
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You are crazy dude there are 4 defeated fighters on the ring mag top 10 and Keith Thurman is nowhere to be seen. And there are 5 defeated fighters above Keith Thurman on the ESPN top 10 p4p list.

Bogotazo · May 29, 2017

tinman said: ↑

Teddy Atlas called Thurman the best athlete in the sport right now. I couldn't believe my brain when I heard that. Uhhh, Anthony Joshua, Russel Jr., Terrence Crawford??? Ring any bells Teddy?

Thurman is hyped.
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He's really not though. Atlas isn't a big mouthpiece. Thurman has no celebrity friends, he's not marketed to anyone outside of the boxing hardcore, he hasn't appeared in any mainstream media, and few if any journalists are putting him in the same sentence as Golovkin, Canelo, Lomachenko, Joshua.

Northadox · May 30, 2017

No welterweight has the movement Thurman has. He can bounce round the ring and box your head off, or stand and trade with you. Not many boxers are as good as he is with 2 styles.

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