"Marciano was the hardest puncher I ever seen" - Don Turner

So you think Turner saw Rocky fight? Turner turned pro in Nov 1959, are you saying Goldman trained him then?

 

Thomas Hauser quotes Don Turner on page 140 of this book :

[url]https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=IQo139Prpf4C&pg=PA140&lpg=PA140&dq=don+turner+professional+trainer+charley+goldman&source=bl&ots=EJTRruOVck&sig=6MHVG0nWicJUoWc1S5BjYTSgOTI&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjYlLWNzNPUAhVrDsAKHYoeCpwQ6AEIQjAD#v=onepage&q=don%20turner%20professional%20trainer%20charley%20goldman&f=false[/url]

The same quotes are used again in this good article by Sean Ingle about Ali-Marciano computer fight from The Guardian :

[url]https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2012/nov/13/forgotten-story-rocky-marciano-muhammad-ali[/url]

While Don Turner, who has worked with the likes of Larry Holmes and Evander Holyfield, still speaks of Marciano with awe. "My first professional trainer was Charley Goldman [the man who guided Marciano]," he says. "We used to sit and talk about Rocky Marciano all the time. He had as much determination as any fighter ever. There was no quit in him at all. He knew what his limitations were and he made up for them by working as hard as any fighter who ever lived.

"Once a boxer starts cheating in training, he can't be great," adds Turner. "Marciano never cheated in training. Out of the thousand or so days that he was champion, I'll bet he was in the gym and working hard for all but 150 of them. If there was a problem in training camp, it was that they had trouble getting sparring partners because Marciano hit them so hard. He wouldn't even take a phone call during the 10 days before a fight. That's how focused his mind was."


More Thomas Hauser on Turner
Don Turner: Opinions and Memories :

[url]https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=i6JRCgAAQBAJ&pg=PA76&lpg=PA76&dq=thomas+hauser+don+turner&source=bl&ots=22ZedPbU3E&sig=IHaZ0qpfH3AgVbCG-17XhwudOCE&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjRgMK5zdPUAhVHBcAKHRmdBqEQ6AEIOTAC#v=onepage&q=thomas%20hauser%20don%20turner&f=false[/url]


I like how that last piece ends with Don Turner saying to mention Bobby McQuillen and Bill Miller ...
"guys like that weren't as famous as the made-for-television trainers you have in boxing today. But they were great boxing guys." ... I like that.

 

Thanks.
Sometimes it's good to check the claims being made.
When I saw the video you posted I was fairly sure Don Turner must have had some sort of closeness to contemporaries of Marciano.

Then people start claming "he wasn't there", "he knows nothing more than we do".
Actually, no, on top of being a great trainer himself, he was training in the same milieu, with the same trainers ,back in the day.
In fact, consider the fact he turned professional (with Goldman) at around the time Rocky Marciano was attempting to get back into shape to fight Johansson, the claims that imply he's not old enough to talk with knowledge of the man or the era seem even more ridiculous.

 

Then I am quite prepared to withdraw that part of my comment.Thanks for the source.

 

Lou Duva: "Rocky would wear you down, wear you down, wear you down. No style, but he would wear you down. He wasn't a Fancy Dan or anything like that. He was never a good boxer. He was a slugger. He would wear you down and then eventually knock you out."

 

Actually it's a great thread because I have learned that Turner was trained by Goldman and so have you!
It's added knowledge so its never wasted! Being the" Keeper Of The Flame" can have its rewarding and unrewarding moments.

 

No, he only had to look at you sternly and you were rendered unconscious.


Lou Duva thought Rocky was God, but apparently he was still rather more objective about him than some here!

 

Rocky Marciano had terrific power. The fact that he could and did wear his opponents down doesn't exclude the reality of his KO punch power.
Most of the heavyweight champs with punching reputations wore their opponents down too.

Marciano was generally a somewhat inaccurate puncher. He missed shots and landing shots on "non-vital areas". Critics and fans of his are in agreement with that, mostly.
The style explains why many opponents tended to last quite a few or several painful rounds with the guy.
To me this seems obvious watching the films of him fight.

As a contrast, you have someone like Mike Tyson who landed accurate punches from the early bell. But even Tyson generally had to connect with a good few combinations to close the show against many of his top opponents. Dempsey was similarly fast starting and accurate from the beginning of the fight.
And most the other heavyweight punchers took rounds to wear guys down too. It's normal.
Sonny Liston was a great puncher and more accurate than Marciano, but he was often known for wearing opponents down with the jab before closing the show.
Earnie Shavers struggled to score late KO against Vincente Rondon, who Bob Foster totally iced in 2 rounds.

Marciano's "one punch KOs" are doubted and disregarded by some, but where are all the one-punch KOs of the others then ?

 

That's a pretty fair post.

 

He was," a somewhat innacurate puncher," but according to you he targeted opponents arms?According to me he was aiming at their bodies but hit their arms because they had brought them down to protect them.

 

I've explained what he did. I said the same thing in the other thread. He aimed anywhere. Yes, he'd rather land on the body or head but when he was being constantly blocked by arms he just carried on punching. That was his style, his attiude, it was deliberate.

Since we both agree he didn't usually land accurately on the typical "one punch KO" areas, you should be able to see how nonsensical it is to cite the amount of punches it sometimes took for him to produce KOs as some sort of evidence against his raw power.