Golovkin-Canelo Is SOLD OUT.

Because boxing likes to make money.

GGG-Ward was a much smaller fight business-wise, and wouldve completely eliminated any possibility of Canelo-GGG regardless of outcome. That's an outcome that produces less money for everyone not named Andre Ward and James Prince. And maybe Roc, if they could actually turn a profit.

 

I know it's silly BUT That sort of thing could actually happen.
Sad part is after so many dubious decisions & referees actions or non actions I'm beginning to wonder if there are still honest officials in Vegas ? If there are the NSAC will get rid of them no doubt

 

ROFLMAO We aint missing MVC too much your posts are almost as ludicrous

 

I pretty ****ing sure Ward-Golovkin was being discussed and Ward's side had sent GGG an offer as early as 2013.
Canelo didn't even fight for the WBC MW title until Nov 2015.

Nice excuse but it wouldn't hold up in court.

My understanding was that Golovkin wanted to drain Ward down to 164 and would not accept 50/50, and thought there wasn't enough money in fighting Ward.

GGG seems to like using money to avoid signing contracts.

 

It my understanding that GGG wanted to fight at 64 for 50/50. Which in my opinion at the time was fair AS LONG AS the 68 titles weren't on the line.

However, as good as that fight maybe for the fans, it would not come close to the dollars as GGG/Canelo. GGG wanted to stay at 60 to chase the big money fight with Canelo, and Ward sure as heck wasnt looking to go down, considerign he was weighing moving up at the time. The fight had no legs, and no money to be made.

 

It is my understanding that Golovkin wanted this, and wanted that, he doesn't want this or doesn't want that. He has way too many demands. Canelo offered GGG a fight at 155 no titles, Golovkin declined. Now you're telling me that Golovkin wanted Ward to drain to 164, but wouldn't do it himself? I swear GGG is lucky Canelo wants his scalp, otherwise he would still be making 2 mil a fight.

That is complete and utter BS, and all you're doing is excusing GGG for not fighting Ward, despite his camp saying they beat Ward, and any fighter between 160-175.

Its utter BS becauase Canelo didn't come to the MW scene, nor considered it until 2015, Ward sent GGG an offer in 2013. Are you suggesting that GGG held out for 4 years just to fight Canelo, even though Canelo wasn't a MW in 2013, and 2014, and 10 months in 2015. That's almost 3 years waiting for a Jr.MW for a retirement check instead of taking real challenges like Ward.

In all honesty, Ward would have been too much for GGG, and him and his camp understood this, that is why they would only accept a fight at 164.

 

Please don't make up things, I have followed the Ward-Golovkin debate for a long time now and I'm sure Ward never sent a contract then. I know there were discussions, but I'll need solid evidence to believe a Ward -> Golovkin contract was sent in 2013. In fact, the evidence is to the contrary, Golovkin says Ward declined the bout in the HBO offices and Ward has never contested that, he responded by instead claiming Golovkin ducked him in 2015.

Golovkin would have taken it in 2013 btw, as you rightly said Canelo wasn't in the MW scene at that time so Ward was the biggest $$$$ fight.

And yes, the bigger Ward may well have beaten Golovkin but that's irrelevant. It would have been a good fight regardless.

 

@IsaL, your whole argument depends on Ward sending Golovkin a reasonable offer in 2013. We all know that Golovkin preferred to aim for the Canelo money rather than Ward in late 2015.

If you can produce clear evidence of this (and I have looked for it without success), I will apologize. But if not, I do think an apology might be in order as it's hardly fair to criticize a fighter based on incorrect information.

Is this a deal?

 

Thats not the excuse they gave.

It was

A. Ward wasn't a PPV fight. Chavez was a PPV fight
B. They had goals at MW
C. They wanted to fight Lemiuex.

Canelo hadn't beaten Cotto till very late in 2015 , they weren't even sure that fight would happen.

They were targeting Cotto and any sane person knew that fight was never going to happen.

The fact here is Golovkin has been stalking lower weight guys all his career.

Ward and now Canelo have stepped up against bigger men. GGG had the chance to face Ward at 168 50/50 and he bottled it

 

I should have said "Canelo or Cotto money" instead because Golovkin wanted the winner, or Cotto if the fight did not happen.

I know some other reasons were said, but we all know it was the money.

 

In 2013 when Golovkin was said to be open to fight anyone between 154-175 Ward called their bluff, and GGGs side then changed their tune and said for Ward it needs to be at 164. I never said a formal offer/contract was made, not usually how all fights negotiations start off.

So why would GGG be willing to fight anyone between 154-175 except for Canelo or Ward? Seems like GGG was being coddled.

Another excuse used was that GGG wanted all 4 belts, something he is yet still to accomplish, even 4 years after making that claim.

Why would Golovkin be so reluctant to fight a non title fight against Canelo 5 pounds below MW but give Ward pretty much the same ultimatum for a fight at 164? Seems a bit hypocritical to me.

I personally don't think GGG would have EVER fought Ward based on all the evidence we have, but there is NOTHING to suggest Ward would not fight GGG, as he moved up and took on P4P Sergey Kovalev in a bigger division against a P4P figher fighter.

 

So GGG's excuse for not fighting is money?

 

Seriously, I am sure the 164 lb talk only started in 2015. I do need better evidence than that to believe otherwise.

Ward was forced to fight either Kovalev or GGG by HBO. That's why he was suddenly keen on fighting Golovkin as it was the bigger, and to most experts, easier fight. In 2013 Golovkin was even more dangerous but more or less unknown, Ward was the bigger star. Golovkin wanted Ward then, not vice versa:

At our meeting with HBO they asked us whether we are ready to box. You know our answers - I said yes, you said no. You said something about your shoulder or promoter - I'm not interested in the reason, I only heard your "no." But you remember that HBO said then that they would need a long time to build-up the fight.

If you look at boxing without bias, you will see that the smaller star usually wants to fight the bigger star more than vice versa. This was the case with Golovkin-Ward. In 2013 Ward was a far bigger star and had no good reason to take a risk against Golovkin (there were equally lucrative and lower risk fights around, plus Ward was fighting with his promoter). In 2015 Golovkin was the bigger star and Ward was the one who wanted the fight. It's quite simple.

 

However, you are changing your tune a bit though, you already twice said in this thread that "Ward sent GGG an offer in 2013" which implies something at least semi-formal, not just discussions.

 

The GGG-Ward negotiations are often twisted to suit agendas here, so here are the facts to the best of my knowledge (corrections with legit sources accepted of course).

1) GGG moving up to challenge Ward at 168 lb had been a possibility several years earlier in 2013, before Ward's legal troubles began. At that stage Golovkin was relatively unknown and was desperate for a big fight while Ward was a major star who had just won the Super 6. Ward apparently did not want to take another risky fight just then, and even if he had a change of heart, his career was soon to be derailed by legal problems. So apparently in a meeting at the HBO offices he said no - something GGG always points out and Ward has never flatly denied.

2) Fast forward several years, and things have changed. GGG is becoming well-known in comparison to Ward, whose profile has suffered from inactivity. Furthermore the prospect of the Canelo fight is very much a real one. So GGG wants to stay at or close to 160 lb, hence the 164 lb offer. Also remember that the possibility of GGG losing would hurt the Canelo fight revenue badly. So GGG wanted to be very well-paid to go to 168 lb (my sources say $8 million was what he wanted). Ward cannot make 164 lb, and he is also not happy to give GGG the lion's share of the pot. From his point of view, GGG is comparatively unproven and doesn't deserve that much. It's also the biggest fight he'll ever get as no other SMW-LHW is more popular than GGG, so he wanted to maximize his earnings there. There simply wasn't enough money in the pot for this fight, GGG getting $8 million would mean Ward got substantially less than that.