Do We Have A Consensus Number 1 All Time Light Heavyweight?

Yes there is no consensus, that said I'd pick Sam first, then a Charles or greb, maybe......tough calls with these greats

 

Masks deserrves another mention.

 

Well technically, Charles was never a LHW champion. So if you mean greatest LHW champion of all time, Charles wouldn't qualify for the running.

But it wasn't his fault. Charles was ducked for a long time. He should've been a 2 division champion.

 

IMO, an aged Holmes was still better than many prime HW contenders and at 42 took a prime Holyfield the distance in a competitive fight.

And at age 45, 10 years older than he was vs Spinks, was very competitive vs a prime McCall. And while McCall wasn't anyones ATG, he was a prime top contender and belt holder coming off of a KO win vs a prime Lewis. Battling a prime McCall to a near standstill as a 45 year old ex champ is impressive. Imagine if Joe Louis in 1960 at 46 years old went the distance with Floyd Patterson in a competitive fight, even if he lost. Or if a 42 year old Ali beat Pinklon Thomas in 1984.

In my opinion Spinks win over Holmes, especially since Spinks was 29 compared to a 35 year old Holmes, almost peers in age, compared to 29 year old Holyfield vs a 42 year old Holmes and a 29 or 30 year old McCall vs a 45 year old Holmes.

Spinks domination of the LHW division and subsequent victory over an ATG heavyweight champion definitely would put him in the running for GOAT LHW and certainly seats him comfortably in the top 5.

 

H2H gimme Roy Jr with all due respect to Charles, Foster, Moore, Spinks etc.

 

I don't think the poster specified champion as a prerequisite.

 

It was a great win regardless. Charles did the same tho.

I'm not sure a win at Heavyweight goes toward Spinks rating at 175 tho. It would go more toward his overall P4P ranking.

I have no problem with him top 5 for Spinks. Having said that there are a lot of great 175's scattered thru history.

 

The only other option is Jones? Really? What did he do to qualify? Compared to the other fighters mentioned on here? He didn't even prove he was the best in his era.

Same here, based on what? There is a big difference in quality of opposition. Sure, Jones looked tremendously but was he as good as he looked? I mean he clearly was an atg talent but we never really gonna know how he would do against the best the division has to offer.

 

Because if it's based on resume or more traditional factors it has to be Charles.

The only way you would rank anyone above Charles is if you have a strong weighting on h2h and given the way Charles thrice beat Moore there's not many LHW fighters anyone would expect to beat Charles. Jones was rated very high by most who watched him so I can imagine those thinking he beats any LHW from history.

All depends on criteria.

But for me, if it's based on h2h Jones takes it. If it's based on anything else Charles takes it.

 

Well, I don't quite agree that it has to be Charles. He might very well be the strongest contender though. But I think there are viable other contenders as well, like Langford, Fitz, Moore, Foster, Spinks.

Why do you need to rely on your imagination about what others who saw him fight are thinking? You can watch him for yourself. And for sure he looked tremendous in most fights. However, the opposition was sub-par for most of this career as well. There are many examples of fighters who looked great against inferior opposition but faltered when they stepped up. Would Jones have? I doubt it and his win over Toney is a hint that he wouldn't have but instead would have looked similar impressive - but then it's inconsistent, slow-footed Toney we talk about here. But overall for me at least there will always be the doubt if he might not have been another Naseem Hamed.
He doesn't have the resume to be ranked high and he does have a question mark over his h2h vs the very best. I don't see him ranked highly to be honest. Too many good fighters who actually did what he could have done in that division.

 

If I'm to give a list based on h2h I rank Jones Jr number 1.

If I'm give to give a list using any other criteria Charles is number 1.

 

Sound reasoning. I'll give it to Henry Maske then.

 

Every list is personal. The beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Nothing wrong with your choice.

 

My personal list

1 Roy Jones Jr
2 Ezzard Charles
3 Sam Langford
4 Gene Tunney
5 Archie Moore
6 Michael Spinks
7 Billy Conn
8 Jimmy Bivins
9 Bob Foster
10 John Conteh