Gennady Golovkin vs Sugar Ray Robinson but welter version

Get back to me when Golovkin has fought somebody. Until then hes an amateur masquerading as a champion with tons of bogus title defenses. I'll say again: The guy is 35 and is just now fighting his first real contender who, surprise suprise is having to move up in weight to do it. Sorry but experience against experienced opposition tells. Robinson had it in spades, Golovkin has ZERO. Tell me: Is there currently a SINGLE fighter on Golovkin's 11 year professional record that any of us will be discussing in 10 years? 60 years? No. They will all be forgotten. Yet Im supposed to honor this nobody with the pretension that he is somehow worthy of being discussed in the same terms of a guy who is often rated the best fighter in history? I dont even care about the weight difference Robinson takes this protected fraud into deep water and drowns him. The same people said the same B.S. about Kovalev and then the first time he actually meets a real threat (who again had to move up in weight to fight him) he loses two in a row and starts talking retirement.

 

Exactly so then if GGG can't cut off the ring against a lesser ring technician then how does he cut off the ring like Lamotta did against a far greater ring technician?

Not really. Jacobs was pretty good about not being put into tight corners. I mean, my idea of doing a good job of cutting off the ring is giving your opponent little room to box and in uncomfortable positions for a good amount of the fight. We didn't see that from GGG against Jacobs.

Here's an example of what I am talking about:
[url]https://streamable.com/f99eo[/url] (Note: I just randomly clicked on a time in the fight and took it to the end of the rd.)

We see GGG applying pressure and keeping Jacobs close to the ropes but constantly Jacobs is finding ways to rearrange the action in order to take the fight back to the center of the ring. GGG never has Jacobs on or near the ropes for more than 6 seconds during which time Jacobs doesn't look uncomfortable.

The clip isn't the entire fight but it gives a pretty good picture, GGG having the better of the action but not controlling Jacobs who gave back a pretty good fight.

 

Even though I'm a GGG fan I think this is a great post and a fair representation of Golovkin right now. I expect Canelo to get the better of GGG in a couple of weeks.

 

I reckon we have more or less stated our cases.

Good discussion, thanks.

PS - Canelo is going down

 

1) Golovkin has cleaned out 160. What more do you want him to do? Who has he dodged?
2) Jacobs > Canelo.

Golovkin has fought a total of 4 fighters with more than 10 losses or losing records. Guess how many Robinson fought?

Take up professional gambling, if you can see the future.

Imma guessing SRR beats Anthony Joshua too

Protected against WHO? Seriously?

Kovalev was good but most people agreed Golovkin had more skills. Most people feel he's 1-1 with Ward. You disagree. OK.

 

Read the article I linked to. The weigh in was shifted back a day in the 1980's to allow boxers more time to rehydrate, in order to replenish their water content and especially the cerebral fluid, in order to reduce brain injuries. Instead boxers predictably abused the system in order to fight at ever lower weights. So you have a guy like Jacobs that is effectively a cruiser shrinking himself to a MW. Golovkin is a small LHW shrinking into MW, as is pretty much the rrest of the MW division. And GGG isn't even a big middle ... by TODAYs standards.

 

Jacobs own team said he was close to 190, and that was their plan the whole time.

If by natural we mean actual fighting weight.
Golovkin is a natural light heavy.
The light heavies today are natural cruisers, Kovalev and Ward are both in the high 180s on fight night.


At the end of the day, the Robinson we are being asked to consider is spotting 25-30 pounds to Golovkin. And when you consider how uncharacteristic a 173 pound Maxim forced Robinson to fight, it looks like he's in for a very long night.

 

Its meaningless to "clean out" a division devoid of talent. And if hes cleaned it out why is he so intent on calling out lighter fighters. Common practice is to move up not down. Claiming everyone is ducking you only goes so far.

If a guy has 25 fights in this era and somehow managed to lose 6 against weak competition then I wouldnt be bragging that Golovkin has only faced 4 men with 10 or more lossed. Only a dumbass would dispute that the level and quality of opposition Golovkin has faced is greater than Robinsons and Golovkin has fought far fewer fights to boot. Wanna count the number of guys Golovkin has fought that will go into the HOF? Ill help: Zero. Now go tell me how many HOFers Robinson fought and how many times. Im betting he he fought HOFers in more fights than Golovkin has had in his entire career.

I dont need to see the future to know that thus far Golovkin has faced nobody that will be etched on the publics imagination.

Oh ok. NOW Kovalev wasnt as good as Golovkin. If Golovkin loses to Canelo will you jump off that bandwagon as well? Lol. Yes, I absolutely think and know (seeing as how the judges ruled that way) that Kovalev lost 2 to Ward. I think the same people who think he won are the same people who thought he should be allowed to continue in the rematch after getting his **** pushed in, you know, fanboys with too much emotion invested i him to actually analyze a fight. The same morons who thought Conor McGregor did well against Mayweather. People more interested in persona than what actually hapoens in the ring. Its why deluded fanboys think a 35 yr old whose never fought a memorable opponent in his to this point pointless career should be discussed in the same sentence as Robinson.

 

Has Golovkin ever fought 13 rounds outdoors in record heat? No? Didnt think so. Hes been over 10 two times in air conditioned arenas. Again, I like Robinsons 15 round experience in outdoor summer ballparks to take Golovkin deep and drown him. While we are at it since you think GGG is rly a LHW Id pick Maxim to beat him as well.

 

That's water weight they are rehydrating. Not "real" weight. A fighter from the past like say Marvin Hagler wouldn't be able to dehydrate to 147 (cut 13 lbs) even if there was a 24 hr weigh in.

Robinson lost because of hydration issues. He would be fighting Golovkin in Air Conditioning over 12. If anything he would have an edge compared to what he was used to.

 

There were serious moves afoot to fight Chavez Jr, Froch and Ward. They are all heavier than him. The fights fell through. But thank you for at least indirectly acknowledging that he has not been "protected". The alleged weakness of this era is subjective.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean here. My point is that amongst the many great fighters SRR faced, there was an awful lot of filler. If GGG had an extra 30 bums on his resume, would that impress you?

Opinion ^

Skills wise I thought not. I think his extra size would be a significant factor in a H2H though.

Au contraire, I rewatched those fights several times. Something like 80% of people thought Kovalev won the first. I'm of the same opinion. I guess I fall into the "fanboy" camp with Mayweather, RJJ et al, then. So be it.

McGregor did brilliantly against Mayweather. I expected Mayweather to destroy him clinically and mercilessly. I expected that Conor would fumble around and look like a fish out of water. I expected that he'd struggle to land leather on him. Instead he arguably took 4 (four) rounds off him. WTF? If a debut boxer took 4 rounds off SRR would that not be an exceptional performance? Conor was NEVER going to win that fight ... but to his credit he actually made it look like a fight and not an execution.

What intrigues ME is at what point size actually begins to matter in your calculations.

GGG is the world's best 175lb (fight night weight) fighter right now. Would you pitch SRR against the Cruisers and expect him to win? How about Usyk? Or Deontay Wilder? Would he beat Wilder too?

I'm thinking that the fanboy card is applicable, but maybe not so much to me.

 

With all due respect you are wrong on this one. Water weight is real weight.

Fighters do not artificially increase their weight with water, that would only amount to a few pounds before they peed themselves in the ring unless they are Camel Men mutants.

Fighters in fact as you know, dehydrate to artificially lower their weight, then they restore themselves to full hydration after the weigh in. There's no such thing as artificial water weight unless they have a serious health disorder preventing their kidneys from working and causing water retention.

 

Are you going to address my point or lecture me on things I already know?