Gennady Golovkin vs Sugar Ray Robinson but welter version

Yes, and he would still be 160 in the ring. Those 13 pounds he regained for Fight Night wouldn't be unreal water weight. It would be the a fully hydrated Hagler.

Nobody told Robinson he had to fight Maxim on a bicycle all night. He was forced into an uncharacteristic fight because he was weary of standing his ground with a 170 plus pound man.

 

Then how do you explain the fact that fighters who don't cut weight are stronger?

Canelo rehydrates into the 180s but he wouldn't be as strong or as big as Rocky Marciano in terms of body dimensions.

 

Hagler boiled down to his minimum fighting weight as did most fighters from the pre-24 hr weigh in era.

Do you think guys just fought at their walk around weight?

 

Who doesn't cut weight? Everyone bar Pacquiao seems to rehydrate 10-20 plus pounds these days. And that clearly caught up with Pacquiao as his power has been less effective since moving to Welter. I think Clottey for instance was well over 160 when they fought if I'm not mistaken.

A 184 pound Canelo and a 184 pound Maricano would in fact be as the same size, but I doubt he is even remotely as strong. Size doesn't equal power. Maricano primarily fought larger men and battered them, Canelo primarily fights smaller men and seems to only have average power even then.

I think that really puts into perspective how special Maricano was. We can't imagine 184 pound Canelo pushing around a 215 pound man and knocking them down with single shots, hell, he couldn't dent Chavez Jr or Cotto. Yet The Rock was moving Joe Louis with his punches.

 

And I would say a guy like Golovkin is probably at his minimum fighting weight at 170, he looks pretty lean. He just dehydrates down to 159 for weigh ins to compete at middleweight because he's comfortable fighting men in the 170-180 range.

If Golovkin fought at light heavyweight, he would be fighting guys like Jacobs or bigger every night.

 

Golovkin KO Canelo 4

The boxing world will be shocked that Golovkin made it so one sided. It'll be similar to Liston Patterson.

This is a bold prediction, but watch!

 

I was referencing fighters from the pre 24 hr weigh in era who didn't cut large amounts of weight like todays fighters.

Canelo and Marciano would be the same size but Marciano would be much stronger. This isn't simply because of the marvel that is Rocky Marciano but also because Canelo isn't a true 184 lbr. The strength difference wouldn't be one like Marciano normally enjoyed over opposition but abnormally large.

To a certain degree size does help with power. For example a typical 160 fighter won't hit as hard as a typical 200 lb fighter. That's beside the point though.

You seem to have inadvertently hit the nail on the head. It isn't a coincidence that Canelo doesn't have amazing strength against middleweights that Marciano seemed to have against heavyweights. It's because dehydrating is weakening. If I strip 15 lbs and then rehydrate in a 24 hr period I won't be able to lift as heavy of weights as I did prior to dehydrating.

 

Golovkin weighs 165 for his typical 30 day weigh in. Highly doubt he is dehydrating for those.

 

Depends on the fighter.

Nobody is a true anything, weight is determined by so many variables and the fighter's intention. Marciano was comfortable fighting men his own size or larger, while Canelo prefers to have a significant weight advantage over his opponents.

There's much to consider.

If it wasn't an advantage, Canelo and countless other fighters wouldn't do it. 15 pounds isn't that hard to cut, especially for younger fighters.

But he likely leaves training camp at 170 ish. 3 days before the weigh in, he'll dry out, make 159, and then a coach will get him hydrated back to 170 again before the fight.

 

It doesn't depend on the fighter. Fighters from before the 24 hr weigh in didn't cut massive amounts of weight to make weight then rehydrate 15+ lbs.

Marciano wouldn't be able to get down to 160 lbs. The 180s were pretty much his bottom out weight.

It's a fact that size does have to do with punching power. More so at the lower weights. I'm not saying that a smaller fighter can't hit harder than a bigger fighter but GENERALLY SPEAKING a middleweight doesn't hit as hard as a cruiserweight. We can do a test on the top 10 cruiserweights vs the top 10 middleweights in terms of power and the cruiserweights will come out on top. That isn't just a coincidence.

It is an advantage compared to weighing just 160. If a 160 fighter rehydrates to 175 then they won't be as strong as a 175 lbr who is in tip top shape without cutting 15 lbs. The rehydrated fighter wouldn't have the full 15 lbs of strength they would have a fraction of that but its better than none in their mind.

No. They cut weight over the entire training camp and make 159 probably dehydrated a few lbs from the previous day then after the weigh in and overnight they put the weight back on through eating and hydrating. Our bodies have muscle memory which allows us to put weight back on easier than it is to build it in the first place. That's how fighters like Errol Spence get up to like 170 after the fight and aren't fat.

 

There's absolutely no way you can prove EVERY fighter from the past is stronger than the ones at present who cut weight. It absolutely depends on who you are comparing. If you are going to argue such broad unmeasurable generalizations as fact, there's really nowhere to go.

Maricano in the 184-190 range falls in the weight range of modern light heavyweights and could theoretically compete at 175 safely just like them if he wished to do so.

This is unfounded presumptions upon unfounded presumptions.

Kermit Citron's conditioning coach used to post here, and he went into details on how he would leave training camp at 168, get him down to 147 safely in three days, and build him back up to 168 by fight night. I would imagine most use a similar program.

 

It depends on the individual. Dan Geale supposedly rehydrated 25 pounds against Cotto and looked to have absolutely no strength. Canelo supposedly rehdyrated 25 pounds against Cotto and looked as healthy and strong as he usually does.

But then again, Dan Geale was 34 years old and Canelo was only 25. So age does seem to be factor in the more extreme weight cutting.

Roy Jones by his own admission was 180 plus in his middleweight fights. As he aged he moved to light heavy without really gaining any weight, he just stopped dehydrating himself down 20, 25 pounds.

 

And Morales had huge problems with his weight fluctuation when he fought Manny. One fight it looked like he was at 50% strength and stamina at best !!!

 

I didn't say every fighter. I said generally speaking. It's pretty easy to understand that a fighter who cuts 15 lbs then rehydrates in 24 hrs isn't going to be as strong as someone of the same weight that never cut in the first place.

That would mean that Marciano had extra weight to cut. Considering his training regime and his year round condition I highly doubt he would be able to make 175. The guy was considered to do a lot of running even for his era. Not much more he can do to bring his weight down. Again, its like with Golovkin and the 30 day weigh in. Fighters cut weight gradually as they get into better and better shape. Marciano's absolute in best shape weight was 185 lbs. He didn't have room to cut. Even though he was a heavy he still cut. Guys like Kovalev walk around at 190, out of shape.

So you're saying that they just cut weight for the hell of it with no advantages? I don't know how you don't get this. If fighter A dehydrates 15 lbs and rehydrates to 175, he won't be as strong as Fighter B who never dehydrated at all but weighs 175 lbs. You understand that the human body isn't designed to cut massive amounts of weight whenever and still operate at the same level right? You don't just drink some water and all of a suddenly become rehydrated again. It takes time.

If we dehydrate Cintron to 147 then rehydrate him back to 168 and put him in the ring with a light heavyweight such as Danny Nardico do you think that Nardico would probably kill him or have as much difficulty as he would with any other light heavyweight of Cintron's attributes?