Who was the better fighter: PBF or Pea?

There is no grasping at straws here, just the facts, and facts you blatantly didn't even touch upon in your post because you know I'm right.

You didn't mention body work, which isn't surprising, since you know Pea's was better and frankly they are worlds apart in this area.

His jab was unquestionably better, and at the very least bossed him more fights than May's does his. This is without question.

You call is walking around, but again, it was unquestionably better lateral movement. You can't even argue the point. If you want, we can post clips of their fights, and see who moves lateral more.

Combination, is again, without question. Neither are huge combination punchers, but Whitaker clearly throws more. He's in the pocket more throwing punches. Granted May's style isn't geared for that, but it's a fact none the less.

Nelson looked the much better fighter moving up than JMM did when he moved up. They weren't even in the same stratosphere really.

Haugen wasn't great, and your comparisons were a change were good. So I won't argue there, but Pea seemed more impressive.

Yes I meant Roger, and no Corrales THAT night wasn't as good as Roger THAT night. Corrales looked drained and a shell of himself that night. I'll give May credit for causing some of that, but Corrales also clearly wasn't at his best. Not a bad comparison, but Roger was better

You actually think Hernadez was better than JLR or has the superior resume? Shall we go there next? And no, May didn't look better beating him than Pea did JLR.

The fact that you even listed Oscar and Shane speaks volumes about how poor May's list is. Oscar was a shell of himself when he fought May, not to even mention the weight draining that took place there and restrictions on weight by May's camp. Pea fought a peak Oscar at the height of his powers while he was well past his best. YOU STILL haven't come up with a comparable fight. You even listed Manny, again, injured and past his best. Yet you're calling this a great victory?

Zab Judah... Zab? LMAO, Greg Haugen has a better resume than Zab Judah. Pea wouldn't even lose more than a round to Zab, May lost more than that till he adjusted. Pea wouldn't need to adjust and lose those first rounds.

You still have yet to mention a comparable victory to Chavez that May has, I'm still waiting on that, but again you skipped over the questions you don't have answers for.

I'm still waiting.

 

Oh man, first, Azumah Nelson looked better against Whitaker because Whitaker didn't dominate him. Marquez moved up to welterweight, and he was dominated by Floyd. Unlike Nelson, however, Marquez returned to welterweight AND WASTED MANNY PACQUIAO with one shot.

So YES, Marquez was better at welterweight than Nelson at lightweight. Nelson just looked better AGAINST PEA because PEA isn't as good as FLOYD.

If you don't like comparing Hernandez with Ramirez, fine. Alvarez, Cotto, Pacquiao. Take your pick. Ramirez wasn't remotely as good as any of them.

Whitaker didn't beat Chavez or Oscar. Why not bring up Carlos Borjorquez, too. Whitaker didn't beat him, either.

And if you think Roger Mayweather was better than Diego Corrales or that Greg Haugen was better than Zab Judah ... you are just lying to yourself.

Because if someone started a thread and asked WHO WAS BETTER: JUDAH OR HAUGEN? Or WHO WAS BETTER: ROGER MAYWEATHER OR DIEGO CORRALES ... you wouldn't be raising your hand and saying GREG AND ROGER.

You're just arguing because you have nothing.

Pernell's best win is Azumah Nelson. Other than that, it's a HUGE drop off to guys like Haugen and Nazario.

It doesn't measure up to Floyd's record at all. Seriously. You know this.

 

It does? Are they worse than Juan Nazario?

 

And from 1997 to 2017 ... nobody beat Mayweather. Not anyone.

Twice as good.

That about sums it up.

 

Luckily, Whitaker never fought Nelson at WW, where it would've been much worse for him and 12 pounds even further away from where Nelson won a title. Nelson moved up ONE division to face Whitaker when he was champion at the division south. JMM moved up TWO divisions to challenged May, and it was clear to anybody watching JMM was a shell of his former self at that weight. He fought 3 more fights before again even thinking about trying to move back up to WW. He was obviously preparing his body to do so, and fought a guy who he intricately know prior. Moving up a fighting a guy you know is one thing, moving up two divisions to fight a guy you've never fought, those are worlds apart. I need to explain this to you? Point being, Nelson was the better fighter that night.

Why are you even bringing up Alvarez? He was green for that fight, and he's clearly improved since then. He's not even comparable to the fighter we see today. So no, he wasn't better than JLR then, and it's not close again. Cotto was a good one, likely one of his better ones, and I'd say it's pretty comparable. Again though, Pea dominated JLR vastly more than May dominated Cotto. That is indisputable.

Actually he did beat Chavez, unless you're claiming that Chavez rightfully won that fight. Did you score it for him?

If not, like most everybody else, we know Pea won that fight. So, can I get a win from May that is comparable?

Pea fought a vastly better version of Oscar than May did, and many on this board, including me, think Pea won that fight. Again, this wasn't past his best against a peaking Oscar. May could only generate a split decision against a well past his best, weight drained Oscar. Not impressive. So tell me, who on May's list is even in the same level as a peak Oscar than Pea fought?

Why do you think Corrales and Judah are so much better than Roger or Haugen? Nobody is saying they are world beaters, but Judah certainly isn't, and Corrales was pretty good for a short period of time. Nothing mind blowing. So you honestly believe Corrales walks right through Roger?

BTW, don't think I didn't notice you not touching the things Pea is better at than May. You claimed may does EVERYTHING better than Pea, and I've proven this false

 

135 Nelson never did a damn thing to prove he was better than a 147 pound Marquez, who happened to have starched pfp 1 Pac while past prime.

@KuRuPT Stop. Canelo's best three opponents, Trout, Floyd, and Lara were all around that time and he only looked like sh it against Floyd (he wouldnt be the only one). He looked "prime" in dismantling El Perro immediately after losing to Floyd. Strange how that works.

 

pete easy

 

Are we still doing this?

What is Whitaker better at again? Better at circling around the ring out of range when no one is punching? Is that what you said? Sure. Fine.

No. Whitaker is not better in the pocket. Ask Ricky Hatton if Mayweather is good in the pocket. Hell Wilfredo Rivera outworked Whitaker "in the pocket."

You said Whitaker had a better jab. When was Mayweather outjabbed in 20 years? Please tell me. Mayweather floored Marquez with little more than a jab. Who did Whitaker floor with a jab?

I know Whitaker didn't have better footwork or a better chin, because he was dropped several times (some legit, some flash) and some had to do with his feet being out of position. Neither happened to Mayweather.

And you keep harping on BIG NAMES on Mayweather's list ... and then you're touting Pernell's wins over Greg Haugen and Juan Nazario and Buddy McGrit.

You insult Mayweather's win over first ballot Hall of famer Manny Pacquiao, but brag about beating shopworn Jose Luis Ramirez in Ramirez's 110th and nearly last fight.

Wins over Oscar (coming off a Ko over Mayorga) or wins over Mosley (coming off a KO over Margarito) are embarrassing, and you brag about beating Juan Nazario.

That's like nitpicking Ali's wins over Foreman and Frazier and touting Wilder's wins over Washington and Arreola and Stiverne.

And I'm sorry, I can't find someone on Mayweather's resume who moved up to a division he wasn't comfortable in for one fight with Floyd ... and then Floyd DREW with him.

Mayweather didn't lose to or tie with the best fighters he faced, like Whitaker did. Mayweather beat them.

When Mayweather fought someone who was green, he turned out to be Canelo Alvarez. When Pernell fought someone who was green, he turned out to be Louie Lomeli.

The careers, the wins, the record of success ... there is just ZERO question Mayweather is on another level than Whitaker.

 

There's only one guy ever in boxing who has wins over three pfp top 5 fighters, one of whom was the best in the world other than himself, several other top ten pfp fighters, several hof bound fighters, and a win over the champion four weightclasses north of his original weight routinely discredited.

 

Good Lord. The only person who would ask this is someone who thinks Whitaker was better than Mayweather.

Floyd Mayweather>Pernell Whitaker
Diego Corrales>Roger Mayweather
Zab Judah>Greg Haugen

Talent wise. Skill wise. Head-to-head. All better.

 

Left out undefeated for 20 years.

 

You can't take someone seriously who thinks Roger Mayweather was better than Diego Corrales. They just don't know what they're talking about and that's the end of it.

 

I am not a Floyd fan, but I have come to appreciate his skill and his legacy. Likewise in regards to Whitaker. But it is his fan boys that turn people off and compels them to have a knee jerk reaction. Don't feed the trolls.

I do think Floyd is better in the record department (duh), as well as ability and H2H...but the margin is slim, and debatable.

Both had great skills, and I find Pea more athletic, with quicker reflexes and anticipation. Perhaps the best I have ever seen fighting off of the back foot, and has the edge in jab as well. I find Floyd more technically sound, and since he didn't rely so much on reflexes he wasn't hurt as they diminished. Brilliant counter puncher....

A shame we should be able to enjoy and appreciate both. No need to denigrate either guy or thier opponents to an extreme. Both have flaws and strengths.

 

Are you seriously saying Whitaker outpointing the shopworn mannequin Jose Luis Ramirez (in his 110th fight, with no more wins coming) was a better win than Mayweather beating the younger Cotto for Cotto's super welterweight title?

ARE YOU DELUSIONAL?

Seriously.

If Floyd Mayweather had outslapped an ancient Ramirez at lightweight, and Pernell moved up to 154 and beat a younger Miguel Cotto, which win would be better in your mind?

Mayweather's over Ramirez? HELL NO. Yet you're saying that about Whitaker.

This isn't some mythical pound for pound we're talking about. These guys fought in the same divisions.

Mayweather's wins came over vastly superior guys. Just look at the guys Floyd and Pernell won titles from.

After losing to Mayweather:

* Diego Corrales won the WBO and WBC Lightweight titles
* Jose Luis Castillo won the WBC Lightweight title
* Zab Judah won the IBF Super Lightweight Title
* Ricky Hatton won the IBO Super Welterweight Title
* Juan Manuel Marquez held WBO and WBA Lightweight titles and won the WBO Super Lightweight title
* Miguel Cotto won the Middleweight Championship and the WBO Super Welterweight title
* Saul Alvarez won the Middleweight Championship and the WBO Super Welterweight title ... and might beat Golovkin in a week or so.
* Manny Pacquiao won the WBO Welterweight title

What did the guys Whitaker beat for belts do afterward?

* Greg Haugen won a WBO Lightweight title
* Julio Cesar Vasquez won a WBA Super Welterweight title

And that's it.

These comparisons are almost comical. Whitaker was a fine champ in his day. But he isn't better than Mayweather ... at all. In no way.

If Whitaker outpointed Canelo and Cotto ... and Mayweather beat Greg Haugen and Juan Nazario ... NOBODY would be bragging on Floyd and poo pooing Whitaker's wins over reigning super welterweight and future middleweight champs like Cotto and Alvarez.

Not in a million years.

I can't do this anymore.

 

Promises, promises...