Fighters who you hold in lower regard than you once did?

Duran one of the greatest technical fighters ever to live.

 

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Maybe Chad Dawson. Not sure what happened there.

 

Tyson Fury is the most amateurish hwt I've ever seen beat a hwt champion. Just a horrible fighter only slightly removed from the amateur ranks. That opinion will never change.

 

Jim Jeffries just doesn't have enough fights under his belt to be rated as high as he is, especially considering the size advantage he had over most of them, many wouldn't even be heavyweights today.

 

I will tell the opposite story.

The close that I have got to Jeffries, the better he has looked.

 

Jesse Clark.

Though I was initially impressed by his trilogy with Buster Douglas, the more I've come to learn about his resume as a whole, the less impressed I am.

 

chavez sr.
padded record full of debut fighters and tomato cans with horrible losing records
lost to laporte, whitaker and others.
decent wins vs haugen and rosario.
got schooled vs taylor and won by ref.
jmm is far ahead in greatness.

 

yeah. well.....
manny had done peds for years.... YOU would do the same to even the playing field.

 

Harold Johnson over the last week for me. It wasn't what anyone else posted, per se, but just the Harold Johnson was undeserving thread caused me to actually examine Johnson's record. The purpose of the thread was to examine Archie Moore's 1956 and later defenses in comparison to Johnson. Well, going in everyone knew Johnson is a HOFer and champion and so a group of average contenders who next to Johnson were the best out there were going to come up short.

But what about Johnson and what he was doing? He simply sat on his rating for years.

Cutting to the chase, how many of Johnson's victims were top five men from 1956 to 1968? I think four. Eddie Machen at heavyweight. Eddie Cotton probably. And Doug Jones and Gustav Scholz. All these fights were in 1961 and 1962. Pastrano could be added but Johnson lost to him. None were champions and none #1 contenders except Pastrano because of beating Johnson. Basically to defend Johnson's consistently high ranking, one has to go back to early fifties fights.

Everyone accepted, apparently, that he was better than all the other contenders, so he never really had to prove it. But what did he do? He beat Eddie Cotton on a split decision. Mauro Mina beat Cotton twice. Wayne Thornton beat Cotton three straight times. He beat Henry Hank. Mina beat him. So did Cotton.

I think Mina did much more than Johnson in the 1960's, with wins over Peralta, Cotton, Hank, and Bob Foster.

Johnson in the 1960's is most notable for whom he didn't fight or didn't defeat--Mina, Peralta, Thornton, Pastrano, Torres, Tiger, Foster--and also Schoppner, Rinaldi, Persol.

That said, Johnson defines classy boxing. He was a great stylist. But his record doesn't match up.

So my opinion of him is not what it was a week ago.

 

Fair enough. But relative to who? Dempsey? Louis? Johnson?

 

Monzon seems less monstrous the more I look at his record and examine video. Not that he's not an ATG middleweight, but just looks more beatable to me than he once did.

 

I thought that of Monzon as I watched his career and fights back in the 70's. The way he utterly mastered and beat up Valdez in two fights changed my opinion. The guy was a beast.

 

Evander Holyfield. A true warrior, but with the PED issue surrounding him, and all the losses later in his career, due to mainly having to support about 10 children out of wedlock, he could have gone out more gracefully and in better financial shape.