Jonny Ruiz in the 1990's vs. Foreman, Holmes, Mercer, Morrer, McCall, and Morrison.

I feel that was some of my better work.

 

Actually, it's quite imaginary, IF you factor in the rules of boxing, basic sportsmanship and the corruption of Don King.

Against any decent opponent, Ruiz blatantly violated the rules against excessive holding in boxing. Against Johnson (as well as against Jimmy Thunder and Holyfield) Ruiz overacted to get low blow calls that allowed him to, disgracefully, get a bogus victory. And against Golota - in a fight in which he hit the canvas twice, lost another point for some illegal move, and was OUTLANDED - he was awarded an outrageously undeserved gift decision.

Ruiz's entire career at the world class level is imaginary - a con game played by Don King on the boxing public, who took a mediocre journeyman with limited skills and used his influence to buy passes for his illegal tactics, shameful low blow fakery, and get him gift decisions in fights he otherwise would have lost. Without King, Ruiz is just another high grade clubfigher who got knocked out by David Tua.

 

They were all way past their best

Holyfield, Tucker and Golota were way past their best.

Name wins mean nothing without context.

Nice try, though

By your logic, Pat Lawlor would be hailed for beating Wilfred Benitez and Roberto Duran

 

How exactly do you describe Marciano's best wins?

 

Ah, the classic Marciano card pull.

 

I am just questioning the consistency of his judgement. Is it a problem to examine if the fighter in question is being judged on even field?

 

Nonsense, especially if you are mourning for older Holyfield who held and rough housed just as much as Ruiz.

It was a dirty fight from both men. Have you actually seen the fight, or just repeating what you heard about it? Johnson was getting battered in Round 9, he had no legs after a right hand. Ruiz was actually cheated out of 3 knockdowns because Johnson kept grabbing his legs, trying to tackle him with his body weight. Johnson had to be helped back to his corner he was so out of it.

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Johnson was getting beat up in Round 10 again, he was in full survival mode, and in my opinion deliberately went low to get out of it.

[url]https://streamable.com/pwd1p[/url]

Ruiz didn't even have to "over react" it was obviously a loaded uppercut below the belt which is why the fight got called. Cortez certainly did a crap job but he had no choice but to call it here.

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Of course they were past their best but you can't completely write them off as nothing wins just because they weren't at their peak.

But the Ruiz Trilogy is in between two of Holyfield's best performances in his older years, Lewis II and Rahman. And Holyfield is pretty good in the Ruiz fights too. It may not be prime Holyfield, but he's not completely washed up and irrelevant either. He was still the #2 guy behind Lewis.

Golota is actually coming off a career best performance against Byrd that put him back in the ratings.

Tucker was washed up for years though, I'll give you that. However, Golota and Holyfield were still top operators in the division. And I will stress once more Holyfield was still seen as the #2 guy and there was talks of a third Lewis fight before Ruiz made his case.

 

Golota was like 60 percent of what he was against Bowe. Holyfield couldn't pull the trigger anymore. He got kod by Toney a short while later. Byrd would have lost to just about everyone on ops list, as well.

78 percent of the votes so far say Ruiz would beat none or one on the list. So, I do have faith in the knowledge of this forum, by and large. There are always a few subjective tards in these types of threads, Seamus being the one in his thread.

 

60% is an implication that Golota was barely half of what he was in 96. Rubbish. He looked excellent in his comeback, I think Byrd and Ruiz are his best overall performances, getting needlessly DQed twice against a shot fighter isnt that all impressive.

Toney fight was 2-3+ plus years after the Ruiz fights, and a comeback fight from major shoulder surgery that finally ended his time at the top. Not a shortwhile later. The fact is Ruiz beat a Holyfield who in his last fight nearly edged Lewis and in his next fight schooled Rahman.

 

I was watching Rocky 5 today. When I started thinking of a real life Union Cane John Ruiz came directly to my mind. The George Washington Duke character trying to bait Rocky into fighting Union Cane. It reminded of Don King trying to bait Lennox Lewis into fighting John Ruiz.

 

Not 3 KD's but the one (last).

First two clearly weren't knockdowns by any means.

1) Ruiz lands straight right, Johnson tries to clinch, Ruiz throws him to the floor
2) Johnson tries to grab Ruiz, Ruiz steps back and Johnson falls. No punches at all. Not a KD (Ruiz also went down the same way vs Holyfield in all of their 3 fights, they weren't KDs)
3) Clear KD.

10-8 round for Ruiz


As for Holyfield 2. Yes, Ruiz won more rounds and even dropped Holy, clear win. BUT.

Ruiz clearly faked low blow in round 10 which was actually a beltline punch followed by a bodypunch. Ruiz acts like Holy destroyed his balls. Ruiz always acted like that when he got hit near beltline.

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Watch closely at 56:20 of this video. Ruiz gets hit to the beltline, then to the body.

He reacts like his balls are shattered. Tries to get DQ from Joe Cortez. Ruiz 'recovers' for nearly 3 minutes from faked low blow.

Then. At 56:35 Ruiz CLEARLY lands hard low blow right on the Holyfield's balls. Holy doesn't react like he got killed (like Ruiz did previously) while this blow was WAY more punishing than Holy's own (which wasn't low).

 

I love Holyfield but Ruiz did to Evander what evander did to Tyson in 97 with the ugly grappling/mauling tactics LOL.
Anyway ruizs tactics can throw fighters off big time and it would depend on how they react and what plan B they have. Even foreman could have trouble if ruiz didnt give him the distance to get the jab going

 

Ruiz was better boxer than many think. His fight vs Rahman was awful, but Ruiz clearly beat Rahman who couldn't do anything in that fight. Same with some other top-10 opponents.

Yes, many of his fights looked like cure from insomnia, and Joe Cortez helped him in some fights, yet he still was effective with that style, and had decent chin and punching power.

 

I saw it as Johnson going down and trying to tackle Ruiz with him, he tried the same thing against Vitali. It looks like something he was just taught to do when he gets hurt. I see what you are saying though. We at least agree the last one was a clear KD.

I don't fault fighters for selling borderline blows. It's something most fighters are taught to do. And I don't deny Ruiz did that.

I was however addressing the accusation that he cheated Johnson in that fight with the DQ. I think Ruiz was actually disappointed in the DQ as he was looking to finish a hurt opponent off, he had been aggressive that whole round and beating Johnson up.