Who is the better "all time Puncher"

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by choklab, Oct 17, 2017.


who was the better all time puncher.

  1. Cleveland Williams was the better All time puncher.

    7 vote(s)
    14.3%

  2. Joe Frazier was the better all time puncher

    42 vote(s)
    85.7%
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  1. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    Those guys ( Cooney, Morrison, Satterfeild, Ruddock) all punched hard. And they all still knocked out better guys than Williams did because you can name the guys they knocked out. But for all their hard punches I don't think any of them (Cooney, Morrison, Satterfeild, Ruddock) were quite as dangerous as Joe Frazier in his prime. I happen to think Frazier hit harder than they all did too and if I didn't think that he hit quite as hard as they did it would not matter because Frazier was Twice as dangerous. Frazier had the ability (at his best) to land with a better shot more often than any of them.
     
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    #46
  2. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yeah, just like he did on Terry Daniel's chin. Or Bob Sattefield's chin. Or Billy Daniels' chin.
     
    Dubblechin, Oct 17, 2017
    Dubblechin, Oct 17, 2017
    #47
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  3. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    #48
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  4. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    Williams very likely hit harder than Liston himself as said by multiple mutual opponents and even Liston himself! Did Frazier hit harder than Liston?
     
    swagdelfadeel, Oct 17, 2017
    swagdelfadeel, Oct 17, 2017
    #49
  5. Wass1985

    Wass1985 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I'd say Frazier gave Liston a good run for his money without a doubt.
     
    Wass1985, Oct 17, 2017
    Wass1985, Oct 17, 2017
    #50
  6. Barberboy

    Barberboy Member Full Member

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    I wouldn't like a crack of any of them!
     
    Barberboy, Oct 17, 2017
    Barberboy, Oct 17, 2017
    #51
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  7. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Which opponents said Williams hit harder than Liston?

    Did Ali? He fought both. Did Eddie Machen? He fought both. Did Wayne Bethea? He fought both.

    There aren't too many guys who fought both me who could've said that. Who did? Who were the multiple opponents of both?
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2017
    Dubblechin, Oct 17, 2017
    Dubblechin, Oct 17, 2017
    #52
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  8. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    "They said he hit harder than Sonny Liston." Also Foreman said a faded Williams was a harder hitter than Frazier.
     
    swagdelfadeel, Oct 17, 2017
    swagdelfadeel, Oct 17, 2017
    #53
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  9. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Williams was 38 when he fought Daniels,21 when he fought Satterfield.But you knock yourself out.
     
    mcvey, Oct 17, 2017
    mcvey, Oct 17, 2017
    #54
  10. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    Never mind what "they say" about Williams ATG power, just concentrate on what "you can see".

    We can't "see" the evidence of superior punch power to Frazier on film. And all things considered this must be why there's no evidence of any faith in it from the board for this poll either.

    So It seems to be sheer lunacy to still insist it is some kind of fact that Williams was a greater puncher than Frazier without the evidence. Nobody really thinks it stands up.
     
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    #55
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I disagree ,I think Williams hit harder than Frazier,I think Ruddock,Satterfield,Morrison,Shavers did too .Was Frazier more effective a puncher? Probably ,did he hit harder I don't think so. You think one thing, I think another ,this isn't going anywhere and now it's boring.
     
    mcvey, Oct 17, 2017
    mcvey, Oct 17, 2017
    #56
  12. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    Will
    williams fought lightheavyweight Frankie Daniels in 1957' and 58'. Williams fought a barber called Billy Daniels in 1963 and 64'. williams fought Terry Daniels in 1972.

    That's 5 fights with 3 guys called Daniels. Williams outweighed all of them and was a probable favourite to win all five fights.

    None of them were good fighters and Williams did not knock any of them out either.

    Joe Frazier was another level.
     
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    choklab, Oct 17, 2017
    #57
  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Frazier defended his title against two of the least qualified contenders of all time in Daniels and Stander, neither of them were ranked, there was virtually no betting on the fights so badly were they outclassed.Both lost but were on their feet at the end, despite being pounded on all night. Same as Quarry,Chuvalo,Mathis,Machen,Bonavena,Ramos,Johnson.
    Frazier has 2 knockouts over anyone of note Jones and Foster both 188lbs blown up lhv's. Now I'm gone.
     
    mcvey, Oct 17, 2017
    mcvey, Oct 17, 2017
    #58
  14. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    this is not the best video to show if your trying to make a case for Williams. He looks like Slappsie Maxie Rosenbloom? Did he ever knock anyone down?
     
    ETM, Oct 17, 2017
    ETM, Oct 17, 2017
    #59
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  15. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    Jimmy Ellis was separated from his senses. A simple fact. He got up and staggered to his stool on instinct. Angelo Dundee stopped the fight after trying to revive Jimmy Ellis. He didn't know where he was or what was going on around him. That was courtesy of Joe Frazier`s left hook! Or perhaps the referee hit him.
     
    ETM, Oct 17, 2017
    ETM, Oct 17, 2017
    #60
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