So if Foreman came along first before Frazier, won at the 64 Olympics and turned professional.? He then wins the vacant belts after ali goes in to exile. So instead of Frazier in Fotc as champ its big George? How does that fight pan out, and Frazier is waiting and watching for his crack at the winner. A different scenario for the big 3.?
Foreman would have beaten the out of shape and rusty Ali who missed so much against Frazier in Madison square plus without the intense heat Ali might not have tried the rope a dope to tire George out and Foreman wouldn`t have got tired as quick due to the lack of Zaire type conditions, but they may have had a rematch before Frazier could fight the winner li would have got in better shape this time the same way he did vs Norton in their rematch, if Foreman won that also then faced Frazier he would beat him the same way as in Kingston, Frazier was all wrong for George, they both came forward swinging and Foreman hit harder and took a better shot, he was too big and his reach led to him landing his bombs first in my opinion.
If George had come along 4 years earlier, hopefully he was fighting Quarry, Bonevana, maybe Old Liston, younger Chuvalo, Spencer, Terrell, Ellis, etc.....and gained more "boxing" experience before he took on the Ali that beat him.
Ali would have beaten Foreman in `71. He was too fast and had too good of a chin and recovery ability. Foreman probably still beats an up and coming prime Frazier albeit in a tougher fight. Joe would have made him dig deep.
Stopped reading there. This is an interesting question. Foreman would have faced a better and more diverse group of opponents, but assuming he has no losses along the way to a matchup with the now active Ali in '71, he probably gets beat over a longer duration than the 8 rounds of the real fight. Ali moves and outlands Foreman, probably getting a similar stoppage in the later rounds, if not, a clear decision victory. Lets say for argument's sake that he won against Ali and is defending against an up and coming Frazier, who just destroyed Norton in 5 or so rounds... I think Frazier stands a better chance, but still doesn't win. Still a knockout victim.
George Foreman could never beat Ali, he can't knock Ali out and he can't match Ali's stamina or speed . Big George is made for him.
I think Terrell could have did well vs George because his guard would absorb a lot of shots like the rope a dope except Ali`s glove control was better than Terrell`s in the rumble from what I seen in a film study.
Ali couldn`t move against Frazier, he just stood in front of him, if he did that against Foreman without the rope a dope it would be a disaster, in the rematch Ali moved and clinched far better that would have helped him more plus he was trimmer so could move away from George. Joe wouldn`t fight Norton because they were friends.
Joe could never take many shots off George and Ali`s speed in `71 wasn`t as sharp as it was in the Frazier rematch.
I can't agree with the notion people keep alive that Ali was so diminished in '71... He did move. Alot. His movement changed as his experience grew. His defense got better. He was the better fighter then than when people cite his high movement days... Its been done to death, but Frazier lost as much as Ali by the time they fought in '71. People act like its the Ali of the Holmes fight when they think of any version later than '67... I maintain my assertion '71 Ali performs better against Foreman than the '74 version. And I'm aware of the Frazier-Norton friendship. It didnt stop Frazier from knocking him dead in sparring. That decided any future fight more than a friendship. This was all hypothetical anyway.
Ali was way faster in his fight with Cleveland Williams in what some describe as the greatest performance eve in a boxing ring, Ali`s judgement of distance back then was amazing, Ali lost weight for his second fight with Cooper so he could have more speed to get away from Cooper`s hook, that makes sense that if he`s lighter he would be quicker and he would be able to move and slip punches quicker, he was way heavier against Frazier and was missing all over the place! His body was in far better condition vs Foreman look how flabby he looked in the first Frazier fight, he got hit much less in the rematch.
Ali beat Foreman in `74. He was already about 32. He wasn't as fast as he once had been. At 29 he was quicker and faster. Even if he couldn't move for 15 rounds he was still able to use other tactics. George just didn't have the all around game to deal with Ali.
Ali was not quick at 29 compared to what he wa like before the lay off and his speed was better in the Foreman fight look how fast his punches were coming.
