GGG is - at the very least - the Greatest middleweight since Hagler

You are also "off kilter" a bit. shadow. The "irony" you mentioned is manufactured based on your assumption. Lol. My position had nothing to do with the GGG/Alvarez fight and everything to do with the Golovkin/Jacobs fight. That was a close fight and was the foundation of my stance. You assumed wrong in believing that I was talking about the GGG vs Alvarez fight, but it's not a big deal. You probably didn't read the posts that lead up to your reply. Mistakes happen

Alvarez can absolutely win rounds legitimately against GGG...Regardless of Canelo moving forward or going backwards. It all depends on his effectiveness from an offensive perspective. If he's consistently laying traps and making GGG pay while moving away he certainly would be credited in winning rounds. But if he's doing more back peddling than producing effective offense while Golovkin is hunting him down and landing his own offense, Canelo can't win rounds that way, especially as the challenger.

Taking the fight to the champion is what a challenger has to do in order to dethrone the king. It doesn't necessarily mean the challenger has to be constantly pushing the champion backwards. I never said that. What that means is the challenger has to force the champion out of his comfort zone and make him fight his fight. Alvarez didn't do that. He fought Golovkin's fight all.night long. If Golovkin opted to use the Alvarez fight plan and was back peddling only fighting in spots, Alvarez would have easily won that fight. However that didn't happen.

 

I just let go of you, so no you're wrong. next time add something thats not useless, cheers.

 

how can i be sleeping better if I am actually NOT chilled. YOU make NO sense!


Golovkin is not lineal, hes near undisputed, end of.

 

You're asking me? I don't know man....I'm just saying you shouldn't get all riled up over this. If you say you are "chilled" then you shouldn't have any issues getting a good nights sleep.

Golovkin is regarded as the top Middleweight champion and the man to beat for anyone at 160 if they want that distinction. It's really as simple as that. The lineal title that Alvarez has holds zero value as Golovkin is recognized as the 160 champion.

 

It's not about what I think lol, I'm not so wrapped up in their own fanboyism that I'm making ridiculous statements like Gennady is the Lineal Champion because he has all the belts lol.

Lets Review Shall We : On Page 18 Mr Drama show stated :

That is a factually incorrect statement and he's trying desperately to fit a round peg into a square hole. It's real simple : What JohnnyDrama99 said there is ridiculous to the point where me and several others are calling him out on it, and informing him as to what a Lineal Champion is. (he may say he understands it but his original post very plainly suggests otherwise) Since Page 18, he's been backtracking trying to act like it's we're the ones that are out of line lmao.

Canelo is the Lineal Champion Period. Gennady did not beat Canelo Period. Anyone who tries to deny these realities should be treated like a fanboy who isn't accepting of reality. (JohnnyDrama99)

 

Much of what you say here I can agree with. I understand what you're saying about Cotto winning it at a catchweight and all that. Now you're saying you accept the technicality of Canelo being the lineal champion, but on Page 18 you stated that Gennady is considered the Lineal Champion which is what started all this back and forth.

Canelo being Lineal Champ isn't a technicality though, I understand that it's an unusual situation with everything that's happened, but the important part is that Gennady and Canelo did meet in the ring to attempt to settle it and couldn't the first time around.

Basically Johnny I'm not sure if you are really a fanboy (I know you said you're not a Gennady fan) because you do make a lot of sense and we've had good debates, but when you make ridiculous statements like Gennady is the Lineal Champion like you did on Page 18 surely you can understand being called out on that lol. Then you follow it up with Gennady beat Alvarez and it just takes it to the extreme. I think it would be a good idea for you to take a step back and admit that Gennady did not actually beat Alvarez (as much as you think he did) and that Gennady isn't the Lineal Champ, Canelo is, not on a technicality, but by winning it in the ring and defending it successfully twice.

 

Lol. What? Why are you replying to me and quoting Kentucky Cobra? Are you alright shadow?

And who are these "several others" you are referring to? I know what the lineal champion is and realize on paper Alvarez holds the label. I never disputed that and acknowledged it numerous times. I just gave my opinion that it doesn't hold much value at middleweight at this time considering Golovkin is without question viewed and accepted as the top middleweight champion. The lineal title is supposed to add clarity to the opaque landscape of the multiple weight classes to dial in on who the "man" is in every division since there are so many titles. The lineal champ is supposed to be "the man" that every other champion and ranked fighter is looking to dethrone to take over that spot. Golovkin is that guy at 160...not Alvarez.

GGG did beat Alvarez based on what unfolded inside the ring. The recorded draw is as meaningless as holding the lineal title and not being accepted as the top middleweight champion. I'm not denying Canelo is the lineal 160 champ on paper nor am I denying Alvarez was gifted a draw in his efforts against Golovkin...I'm just saying both hold no value in the current state of the middleweight division

 

I'm absolutely a Golovkin fan....I'm also an Alvarez fan. I'm a fan of many boxers. I'm just not a fanatic of any one particular fighter to the point where I'm biased or partial. I'm just being honest when I say Golovkin beat Alvarez. Just as honest when I say Lewis beat Holyfield or Whitaker beat JCC. I don't give any of those recorded draws merit and there aren't many fans who would outside of ardent JCC, Holyfield or Alvarez fans.

 

Well you're trying to lump Canelo G in there with two of the most controversial draws of all time for effect. I'm with you that I thought Lewis beat Holyfield pretty clearly likewise I thought Whitaker beat JCC pretty clearly. However, I unlike you, don't lump Canelo G in with those because of how different of a fight it was from those. By the way, I like Triple G as a fighter and respect him. I try to seperate the fighter from his fans, or at least the ones I engage with on here.

I just think it's silly for you to try to compare Canelo G to those other fights, it's frankly insulting to me as a boxing fan and hard to take you seriously because it's like we're watching a completely different fight. And I like you consider myself a very unbiased impartial judge of boxing. That's why when I go over the round with you, there were several rounds that I still haven't decided how to score it. I didn't just give rounds 8 and 9 for example to Alvarez even though I thought he landed the better punches. If I was really biased for Alvarez I would have given him those rounds and would have him winning 9-3 but I didn't. When you have so many close rounds I don't know how you can act like it was like JCC Whitaker or Lewis Holyfield which are much clearer wins and more controversial as draws than Canelo G which could legitimately be a draw based on how many close rounds there were.

It's especially frustrating for me to hear you make this argument when you've given me your scorecard and the only rounds separating your card from a draw is rounds 2 & 11, rounds that all 3 judges and most observers gave to Canelo. I just don't understand why you stick to such an argument when as you break it down it just doesn't check out. The only conclusion I could come to is that you're just a Gennady fan who just can't bring himself to admitting it was a close fight. But then you've stated that you're neutral and are a Canelo fan as well so I just don't get it. It would be a lot easier if we could meet halfway and just agree that it's one of those fights that can be seen either way, but you're unwilling to do that. Not only that, but then you take it up a notch even further by making statements like most consider Gennady the Lineal Champion etc and it just comes off as "this guy is just a Gennady fanboy detached from reality". Again, you leave me to no choice as to believe that's what you are because it's not just one thing. It's ridiculous pro-Gennady claim one after another. Again, you're entitled to your opinion, which I have no problem with, like you thinking G won, it's just your inability to concede that the fight is close etc that's insulting to me as a fan who considers himself unbiased and shows that I'm unbiased by admitting such a thing like the fight was close. Generally it's hard to say you're unbiased if you can't admit that a fight that you saw one guy winning was close, and you don't get into specifics when prompted to break it down round by round. It just doesn't add up and it would be far better if I could have a better idea where you're coming from, because form my perspective, though some of what you say makes sense, you're "final conclusions" if you will just come across as incredibly biased in favor of Gennady, which naturally would suggest that you may be a G fanboy. If you're not, then my mistake, but that's what many of your statements come across as.

 

I totally get you when you say it's "hard to take you seriously" based on how you perceived the Golovkin/Alvarez fight unfolding. However, I don't take it as disrespect towards me that you have such a stark contrasting POV on how the fight played out. It just baffles me.

I didn't see many close rounds at all in the GGG/Alvarez fight nor did I see many close rounds in the LL/Holyfield & Whitaker/JCC fights. All were so crystal clear to me that I understand why there was such an overwhelming number of fans who disagreed with recording those 3 fights as draws.

Like I said, I'm a fan of GGG but it doesn't mean I will just give him rounds because I enjoy watching him fight. I also like Alvarez...I actually like to watch Canelo as a boxer more because I'm partial to his style...but just because I like his style more doesn't mean I'm just going to give him rounds based on style points. I'm also a fan of Danny Jacobs...but I didn't give him the edge in his fight with GGG because I liked him more than Golovkin. I just felt he did enough to pull out a razor thin decision. Alvarez didn't do enough to beat Golovkin...he didn't even do enough to get a draw.

If you believe me to be a Golovkin fanboy that's cool. Because I feel you are a over the top Alvarez fanatic. I'm not going to say it's gospel...but if it walks, talks and looks like a duck, I'm automatically going to assume it's a duck. But I respect you enough to consider when you tell me you're not. It's just difficult to wrap my head around how wide the delta is between what you saw vs so many other people who all had Golovkin beating Alvarez in clear fashion.

 

You have the patience of a saint

 

Lol.... I'm actually very patient. I hear it's a virtue.

 

What....i gave my opinion.

I agree with Transnational Boxing Ratings.

Canelo vacated his lineal claim by leaving the division for well over a year. Hes the #2 challenger.

 

I have no patience for Shadow, if you cant make your point on a damn boxing board in a few sentences you are just rambling in the hopes people get bored reading your posts and wont call out your crap.

Thats been his prefered method of arguing since Canelo got out boxed by Golovkin.

 

If you don't want to read a post, then don't read it, but to sit here and complain about it is petty. Since Canelo outboxed Gennady, there's been plenty of back and forth on here and it goes both ways. I'm quite happy to go tit for tat with a poster like JohnnyDrama99. As you may know, what determines Lineality is Title Fights involving the Lineal Champ. Alvarez never retired, he made it very clear that it was his intention to fight Gennady at Middleweight, which he did and it was declared a draw. He was recognized as the Lineal Champ going into Sept 16, Max Kellerman stated this several times in no uncertain terms. At the press conferences and in the pre-fight, Alvarez was announced as the Ring and Lineal Champion. This isn't something that I have to prove. Lineality is a very basic fundamental concept. Even JohnnyDrama99 who on Page 18 claimed that G is considered the Lineal Champ admitted Canelo is technically the Lineal Champ, so it's pretty clear as to who the Lineal Champ is. It's not "what I believe or think" it's who is clearly recognized as such.