GGG is - at the very least - the Greatest middleweight since Hagler

yeh maybe u have a point.

 

I shouldn't have to point out that I'm not Bob Bennett and I'm not the Las Vegas Athletic Commission or other Officials that made official statements on the situation. They are the ones that changed their tune. Like the media, I'm just the messenger, telling you what was said.

And the whole point you are trying to deflect...Byrd's performance was universally called out for being outrageously incompontent.

 

Yes it is pretty serious that you completely misintepreted whats been said to you SEVEN times in a row straight into your ear.

want to make it 8?

 

Well this is a real middleweight era pal, like it has been since the middleweight era existed. Guess what, hes ruled it for near 10 yr. ! I know it hurts, but you cant change the FACT !

 

I got in from work KC and your giving him a response to absolute weirdness. I go for a couple pints, comeback and your still trying to make sense of weirdness. Hes a troll, that couldn't say his opinion in public because its lies and he wouldn't have the balls unless he was ill. I get sucked in sometimes and when I stand back, I could head butt the wall looking at what i'm trying to prove lol. Yeah that **** should be gone(Bird). Ugly inside and out !

 

Your like that Blizzy fella. Your relentlessly thick as fook

 

Well, I grant you that we have some people who weigh in at one hundred sixty pounds, but you know what I was getting at. Even while there seemed an abundance of interesting competitive matchups to be made there at one time, the quality bar at middleweight has been set relatively low throughout Golovkin's run as a titlist.

 

klitschko had the same problem, Hopkins too, but you can see past it, look at them as a package. Honestly who did Larry Holmes ever beat that was really good?? That was really on it and prime ? Who did Lennox beat on it and prime ???? Very few fighters get that chance. Longevity puts it to bed in my book to some extent. Not every fighter lives in a golden era. All fighters I mentioned are great, but by your logic their shite !

 

I was never too struck on Klitschko's package. Hopkins is a rather atypical example of boxing greatness, in that his glory was only truly established after 40 (and after middleweight), primarily by the nature of his feats as an elder statesman relieving younger guys of their trinkets and baubles (or their souls, in Pavlik's case). Lennox's best names may have been compromised by being past their halcyon days, but he has a much stronger overall body of work than Golovkin, having operated in a heavyweight era with a higher general quality bar than that of GGG's middleweight era. Holmes, for all the less than glittering names on his record, does have wins of greater note than any of Golovkin's.

Incidentally, all of those guys, with the exception of Klitschko, are cannier, more rounded fighters who fare better in terms of evaluation by eye. I just don't see the machine that others seem to see in GGG. A guy like Michael Watson would've beaten him up, IMO.

 

Nice explanation. Who did Holmes beat though? My point being, he beat no one great but you can see what he's about, no one head and shoulders on their night compared to GGG's opponents.
With Hopkins though, he was voted as one of the best or IS one of the best at 160 after beating an average bunch with atg Welters thrown in, whys that and not GGG?
If your American UK or Mexican the plaudits seem to come far easier imo

 

Straight into my ear? Says the "chilled black guy". Really....and you wonder why I have these concerns about you.

 

Larry had a still-useful Norton and a Shavers who had just destroyed Kenny, and some of his wins against undefeated fighters are overlooked too readily by some (Snipes and the clinic against Bey at the more modestly creditable end, with Cooney and 'spoon standing out as very solid wins).

Rightly or wrongly, I think perception of Hopkins as a great middleweight has gained validation by his unusual post-middleweight feats moreso than anyone he beat in his signature weightclass. There'd be a lot more speculation and scrutiny of Hopkins' validity as a middleweight great if he'd faded away after the Taylor fights (the first of which I thought he won, for the record).

 

I never denied that Byrd's card was controversial. It seems like the majority and casuals generally prefer come forward fighters and when they see a fighter backing up, they may be less inclined to give that fighter the round. You alleged incompetence and / or corruption with Byrd, and having reviewed the fight, I am not convinced she was either. To get to the bottom of this, we need to examine rounds 3,5,6,8&9 which were the rounds that she scored to Canelo that the other judges gave to Triple G. Round 3 was a round that many fans gave to Canelo so we can eliminate that one. Round 5 seemed to be a fairly debatable round in my estimation and the live HBO punch stats had Canelo ahead in total punches. Canelo appeared to be winning Round 5 for the first 2 minutes until that sequence with Canelo on the ropes that turned the tide for G and G finished the round strong with Canelo backing away. Round 5 comes down to who was better, Canelo in the first 2 minutes of the round or G in the final minute starting with the big right hand he landed on Canelo. I personally gave that Round to G for his momentum changing punches, but you can't ignore how well Canelo was doing in the first 2 minutes, so I see that as a toss up round.

So really it comes down to rounds 6, 8 & 9. These are the rounds that we need to examine to decide if she was truly incompetent. Now as I've pointed out, Canelo landed a scintillating head crunching uppercut in the 6th and another major uppercut in the 8th. In the 9th Canelo landed a hard right hand and several other big punches.

I'm not convinced it was incompetent for her to give these rounds to Canelo because even though G appeared to outwork and even outland Canelo in these rounds, Canelo landed the bigger more eye-catching punches and overall the best punches of the round. This is literally what it comes down if you are examining whether or not Byrd was incompetent : the rounds that she gave to Canelo that the other judges (or most fans) didn't. In my estimation Rounds 8 and 9 were much closer than many G fans are willing to admit, as most people seemed to give the impression that these were clear G rounds. With the uppercuts and hard punches that Canelo landed in these rounds, I find it reasonable for a judge to give some or all these rounds to Canelo. But personally I wouldn't give all of those rounds to Canelo, as I think that's a little much.

I'm guessing that when she reviewed the fight with Bob Bennett she pointed out the big punches that Canelo landed to him and explained that G's punches landed in those rounds just didn't compare to those bombs that Canelo landed. And presumably Bob saw what she was referring to (the uppercuts by Canelo, etc) when reviewing the film and allowed her to continue judging. You may vehemently disagree with all this and that's your perogative, but in my estimation it's reasonable to give those rounds to Canelo due to the quality of the punches he landed. The 6th in my estimation though I didnt think Canelo did enough outside of that uppercut, that's really a stretch to give that Round to Canelo as I thought G won that round pretty clearly down the stretch despite Canelo landing the best single punch of the round. On the other hand, 8 & 9 were much closer and more reasonable Canelo rounds, but I totally understand you thinking G won those rounds and don't have a problem with you or anyone else seeing it that way.

 

The issue I brought up was the topics I have been reading from Triple G fans about how they don't want him to rematch Canelo, not when Gennady or Canelo themselves or their promoters wanted the rematch. How you would interpret that as me having "major issues upstairs" for accurately pointing out I was referring to topics on this forum that G fans posted about how they wanted him to duck the rematch, is beyond me.

Once again, the argument at hand was topics that I'm reading on here of G's fans wanting Gennady to duck the rematch. You changed the argument at hand to when Gennady himself wanted the rematch or what DLH wanted, which wasn't what I was referring to.

Just a boxing fan who wanted to see the rematch ASAP.

I'm not saying he didn't want it ASAP. You may be right about that, once again I was referring to the topic saying he shoudn't rematch Canelo but instead should go after BJS. I find it interesting that while you brought up and criticized DLH's comment about how fighting Lemieux or BJS was an option, you got other Triple G fans wanting G to do exactly that.

 

Hopkins was established years before he was 40. He didn't get paid like he did later in his career but Hopkins was viewed as one of the best practitioners in the sport by ruling the middleweight division.

He had a resurgence a couple of times in his legendary career that extended well into his 40's.

GGG's ruling in an era much like Hopkins where there are no noteworthy names to bring attention to the division so it's deemed, weak. But a lot of that has to do with the level GGG is on and the level Hopkins was on during his reign. In retrospect, Hopkins body of work at 160 had some really good fighters who could definitely box but couldn't rise to the level of the great Bhop. It aligns with what Golovkin is going through now.

The 90's in the Heavyweight division was stellar. Lennox beat a top teir crop of boxers and had some bumps along the road. He rose from defeat and created a legacy that is quite impressive in terms of quality and longevity.